Who Says We Must Fear God?

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

Who wrote this Scripture? Proverbs 9:10

"The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding."

Solomon

Where did Solomon's Wisdom and Fear lead him? I Kings 11:1-11

"But king Solomon loved many strange women, together with the daughter of Pharaoh, women of the Moabites, Ammonites, Edomites, Zidonians, and Hittites:

Of the nations concerning which the Lord said unto the children of Israel, Ye shall not go in to them, neither shall they come in unto you: for surely they will turn away your heart after their gods: Solomon clave unto these in love.

And he had seven hundred wives, princesses, and three hundred concubines: and his wives turned away his heart.

For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, that his wives turned away his heart after other gods: and his heart was not perfect with the Lord his God, as was the heart of David his father.

For Solomon went after Ashtoreth the goddess of the Zidonians, and after Milcom the abomination of the Ammonites.

And Solomon did evil in the sight of the Lord, and went not fully after the Lord, as did David his father.

Then did Solomon build an high place for Chemosh, the abomination of Moab, in the hill that is before Jerusalem, and for Molech, the abomination of the children of Ammon.

And likewise did he for all his strange wives, which burnt incense and sacrificed unto their gods.

And the Lord was angry with Solomon, because his heart was turned from the Lord God of Israel, which had appeared unto him twice,

And had commanded him concerning this thing, that he should not go after other gods: but he kept not that which the Lord commanded.

Wherefore the Lord said unto Solomon, Forasmuch as this is done of thee, and thou hast not kept my covenant and my statutes, which I have commanded thee, I will surely rend the kingdom from thee, and will give it to thy servant."

Solomon quit fearing YHWH. Same story many times. When people lose the fear of God they turn and commit sin.

[NotforSale]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Solomon quit fearing YHWH. Same story many times. When people lose the fear of God they turn and commit sin.

But his Wisdom led him to this place of complete failure. You said, Mike, Wisdom comes from Fearing God and those are Solomon's words.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

But his Wisdom led him to this place of complete failure. You said, Mike, Wisdom comes from Fearing God and those are Solomon's words.

There is "enduring faith". When one loses faith it matters little what they knew or did before.

Jesus said fear God because he can put you in Hell after he has killed you.

If that's nothing to you so be it.

[KeptByTheWord]

I've understood the two different concepts of fear to be:
1) Reverential godly fear
2) The enemy's paralyzing fear

The fear of the Lord brings reverence and respect, which faith is a product of, of which faith helps us to overcome our sins and failures, which ultimately will lead us to eternal life.

The fear of the enemy paralyzes us, and caused us to tremble, focus on our inabilities, and sins, which causes us to stumble, fall, and fail, which ultimately will lead us to the place none of us want to go.

Godly reverential fear produces faith ... and eternal life as a final result
Fear from the enemy paralyzes and produces... death as its final result.

[Abiding Now]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

I've understood the two different concepts of fear to be:
1) Reverential godly fear
2) The enemy's paralyzing fear

The fear of the Lord brings reverence and respect, which faith is a product of, of which faith helps us to overcome our sins and failures, which ultimately will lead us to eternal life.

The fear of the enemy paralyzes us, and caused us to tremble, focus on our inabilities, and sins, which causes us to stumble, fall, and fail, which ultimately will lead us to the place none of us want to go.

Godly reverential fear produces faith ... and eternal life as a final result
Fear from the enemy paralyzes and produces... death as its final result.

The "enemy's fear" is cast out by PERFECT LOVE.

1Jn_4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

NOTICE: It did NOT say that perfect love casteth out ALL fear because the fear of the Lord is clean.

Psa_19:9 The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by Abiding Now

The "enemy's fear" is cast out by PERFECT LOVE.

1Jn_4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

NOTICE: It did NOT say that perfect love casteth out ALL fear because the fear of the Lord is clean.

Psa_19:9 The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.

I'm glad that you pointed out that perfect love doesn't cast out all fear. That is a false notion people believe. Perfect love in Christ casts out the fear of the enemy, but leaves a respect and holy fear of the Lord.

[Abiding Now]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

I'm glad that you pointed out that perfect love doesn't cast out all fear. That is a false notion people believe. Perfect love in Christ casts out the fear of the enemy, but leaves a respect and holy fear of the Lord.

Thank you.

[Michael The Disciple]

It is true the fear of the Lord includes "reverence" and "respect". Nonetheless the fear of YHWH in scripture also heavily leans to fear as "fright". There is a move about nowadays to downplay this. It comes from Preachers everywhere.

Note the CONTEXT of Jesus in this verse.

Matt. 10:28

28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.


Christ is talking about fearing God because he can destroy our soul and body in Hell. So on THAT BASIS Christ commands us to fear God.

The context itself shows the true meaning. The Greek word for fear here "phobeo".

Its first two meanings.

1. To frighten
2.To be alarmed.

This is in truth the fear of the Lord that IMO really needs to be restored. The "reverent" fear is good. It is deep respect. Nonetheless sometimes the fear and dread of God will keep you from sin when nothing else will.

[Abiding Now]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

It is true the fear of the Lord includes "reverence" and "respect". Nonetheless the fear of YHWH in scripture also heavily leans to fear as "fright". There is a move about nowadays to downplay this. It comes from Preachers everywhere.

Note the CONTEXT of Jesus in this verse.

Matt. 10:28

28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.


Christ is talking about fearing God because he can destroy our soul and body in Hell. So on THAT BASIS Christ commands us to fear God.

The context itself shows the true meaning. The Greek word for fear here "phobeo".

Its first two meanings.

1. To frighten
2.To be alarmed.

This is in truth the fear of the Lord that IMO really needs to be restored. The "reverent" fear is good. It is deep respect. Nonetheless sometimes the fear and dread of God will keep you from sin when nothing else will.

Sobering thoughts. Thanks.

[KeptByTheWord]

If one spends any time at all reading the OT, especially Isaiah and Jeremiah, you begin to understand the concept of an angry God dealing with unrighteousness. I believe Jesus came to balance the judgmental side of God with compassion, love and mercy, but we must not ever forget that God is first and foremost a righteous God.

A book I read recently by A. W. Tozer called "A Knowledge of the Holy" deals with this very subject. Too many have forgotten the holy, and righteous God, in light of the mercy and grace that Jesus ushered in for us. There is a balance to both. Either one without the other are lopsided, and bring about destructive results.