The Plight of the Liberal:

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by theoldpaths

I don't see the word Liberal or Conservative or Ultra-Conservative used in the NT at all.

I do see the words blameless, obedience, holy, without spot, wrinkle, blemish, etc though.

Preach on, OP! You are totally correct and we needed reminded.

Respectfully,
Rhoni

[JN Anderson]

Originally Posted by Rhoni

Preach on, OP! You are totally correct and we needed reminded.

Respectfully,
Rhoni

Can you explain what he is "correct" about?

[JN Anderson]

Originally Posted by Rhoni

Not if you are looking for a fight or being condescending which is what I perceive about this.

Rhoni, I think you should know better. Don't shift here. Be still. If you would have read my post fully you would have understood my point better, instead you say it is psychobabble. I think I was trying to divert your jab to get to the point. So, stop swinging and answer this, where's the psychobabble?

[JN Anderson]

Originally Posted by theoldpaths

I don't see the word Liberal or Conservative or Ultra-Conservative used in the NT at all.

I do see the words blameless, obedience, holy, without spot, wrinkle, blemish, etc though.

Regardless, the concepts are there but understood and conveyed in other forms. We are talking about a collection of books mostly written in and around the 1st Century. The Jewish sects and their liberal and conservative interpretations, and then those of rabbinic Judaism imply this generally. That is not the point. The point is what to do with the problem of liberalism that his been gaining rapidly in our culture as it has grown too fond of existentialism? A society that is basically driven by the Eastern notion that Truth is within and not without.

When Truth is is beginning to be determined, largely, upon the human condition then we lose the concept of being a disciple and follower of Jesus, the Christ. We belong to Him. That belonging will demand things of us that we may not ever want to let go of, or possibly completely understand.

[Aquila]

The issue isn't liberalism or conservatism. There are vast numbers of godless conservatives who worship at the altars of secular humanism.

The issue is "sin".

Philosophically liberalism does tend to greater personal freedom while conservatism tends to restrict personal freedoms.

But here's the deal...sin.

Politically: Of course the greater personal freedoms are embraced the more visible man's sin becomes. The more restricted personal freedoms are the more hidden man's sin becomes. In either case...the sin is still prevelant. Politically, both liberalism and conservatism are incapable of dealing with sin.

Religiously: Liberalism seeks to redefine religion and religious beliefs to accomodate man's opinions and preferences. This is dangerous. However, occasionally theologically libera approaches to Scripture bring great truth. For example, the "conservative" position on the Godhead is Trinitarian. Antitrinitarianism is regarded in mainstream religious circles as being liberal. But for the most part religious conservatism is known for attempting to preserve religious traditions, practices, and interpretations.

Politically, I lean moderate (centrist) to liberal because I am a strong believer in individual freedom and human rights. Religiously and theologically I tend to be very conservative.

[theoldpaths]

Originally Posted by Sabellius

Regardless, the concepts are there but understood and conveyed in other forms. We are talking about a collection of books mostly written in and around the 1st Century. The Jewish sects and their liberal and conservative interpretations, and then those of rabbinic Judaism imply this generally. That is not the point. The point is what to do with the problem of liberalism that his been gaining rapidly in our culture as it has grown too fond of existentialism? A society that is basically driven by the Eastern notion that Truth is within and not without.

When Truth is is beginning to be determined, largely, upon the human condition then we lose the concept of being a disciple and follower of Jesus, the Christ. We belong to Him. That belonging will demand things of us that we may not ever want to let go of, or possibly completely understand.

I'm not sure we can ever do anything about liberalism except stand for truth.

When the kingdom of Israel was split due to rebellion against God-given authority, even in the kingdom of Judah sometimes there were kings that did NOT like their fathers but turned to the groves, high-places, etc. Eventually, they would face judgement and die but were NOT buried with the Judah kings which did that which was right in the eyes of the LORD. Then their son would be annointed and do that which WAS right in the eyes of the LORD.

So even tho the kingdom of Judah was preferred over the kingdom of Israel, even in the preferred kingdom, the ruler messed up. A big question that could be asked is why? If his father did that which was right and was a good example to him, and his grandfather as well, why then when the grandchild became king, did he turn to the groves?

So even in a very good situation, things can still go backwards. Kinda like the devil I guess - he was in a perfect situation, but iniquity was still found in him.

[JN Anderson]

Originally Posted by theoldpaths

I'm not sure we can ever do anything about liberalism except stand for truth.

When the kingdom of Israel was split due to rebellion against God-given authority, even in the kingdom of Judah sometimes there were kings that did NOT like their fathers but turned to the groves, high-places, etc. Eventually, they would face judgement and die but were NOT buried with the Judah kings which did that which was right in the eyes of the LORD. Then their son would be annointed and do that which WAS right in the eyes of the LORD.

So even tho the kingdom of Judah was preferred over the kingdom of Israel, even in the preferred kingdom, the ruler messed up. A big question that could be asked is why? If his father did that which was right and was a good example to him, and his grandfather as well, why then when the grandchild became king, did he turn to the groves?

So even in a very good situation, things can still go backwards. Kinda like the devil I guess - he was in a perfect situation, but iniquity was still found in him.

Great post. Especially the bolded part.