Do you believe this applies to ex-upc and liberal

[COOPER]

Do you believe this applies to Ex-UPC and liberals?

Jude 1
1Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called:

2Mercy unto you, and peace, and love, be multiplied.

3Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

4For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

5I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not.

6And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

7Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

8Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.

9Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

10But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.

11Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.

12These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;

13Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.

14And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

15To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

16These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

17But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;

18How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.

19These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.

20But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

21Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

22And of some have compassion, making a difference:

23And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

24Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

25To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

[COOPER]

Well......The reason I started this thread poll is:

If I were still deeply rooted in the UPCI faith and doctrines as I were in the 90's;

I would vote yes and openly rebuke any one that has departed from standards, doctrines and attended Trinitarian churches.

I would have said, that some one like my self was a part of the, "Falling away"

Originally Posted by COOPER

Well......The reason I started this thread poll is:

If I were still deeply rooted in the UPCI faith and doctrines as I were in the 90's;

I would vote yes and openly rebuke any one that has departed from standards, doctrines and attended Trinitarian churches.

I would have said, that some one like my self was a part of the, "Falling away"

So what do you say now? Were you wrong then or are you wrong now? How can you be sure? What has changed, you or the truth or neither?

[Ferd]

Coop, you don’t have an option for "SOME"

Yes, I believe this does apply to some who have left the UPCI/traditional Oneness Pentecost.

But not all.

Leaving standards is something I have a real problem with, but it isn’t something that will stop me from calling a person Apostolic.

Leaving the Doctrine however, fits the scripture.

(Please note, I have always believed there is a place within the "Pale of Orthodoxy" for both the Water/Spirit Doctrine and the PCI view as well)

However, when a man will baptize any way you like, when a man doesn’t care if the people receive the Holy Ghost. When a man will allow homosexuals on his platform (If I were inclined I could name one who has that would freak a lot of the libs around here out)

Then that person is subject to Paul’s admonition.

[COOPER]

Originally Posted by philjones

So what do you say now? Were you wrong then or are you wrong now? How can you be sure? What has changed, you or the truth or neither?

I was miss informed.

My UPC pastor and The UPCI [with good intentions] use doctrines, rules and traditions to keep the saints saved.

It's easy to Use JUDE 1 as fear doctrine to keep the sheep fenced in.

Jude adresses complaining, authority and also puts a label on those that to not stay with in guide lines.

Also Judment.


Is Jude adressing keeping standards or obeying the pastors wishes?

A pastor can use this verse to preach against many things or even keep saints from moving on.

[Mrs. LPW]

What is your reply to Ferd Coop?
I tend to agree with him.
I certainly don't believe living UPCI means hell and damnation... UPC is only an organization for specific purposes but is not the part and parcel of the Church.

[COOPER]

Originally Posted by Ferd

Coop, you don’t have an option for "SOME"

Yes, I believe this does apply to some who have left the UPCI/traditional Oneness Pentecost.

But not all.

Leaving standards is something I have a real problem with, but it isn’t something that will stop me from calling a person Apostolic.

Leaving the Doctrine however, fits the scripture.

(Please note, I have always believed there is a place within the "Pale of Orthodoxy" for both the Water/Spirit Doctrine and the PCI view as well)

However, when a man will baptize any way you like, when a man doesn’t care if the people receive the Holy Ghost. When a man will allow homosexuals on his platform (If I were inclined I could name one who has that would freak a lot of the libs around here out)

Then that person is subject to Paul’s admonition.

Great point Ferd.. Maybe the Admin could insert "SOME" as a choice.

[COOPER]

Originally Posted by Mrs. LPW

What is your reply to Ferd Coop?
I tend to agree with him.

Yes, I agree too.

[My Own Eyes]

Originally Posted by philjones

So what do you say now? Were you wrong then or are you wrong now? How can you be sure? What has changed, you or the truth or neither?

I would say that I think that I was wrong then, and I may still be wrong now. That there is no way we can ever really be sure about anything. And that everything is in a constant state of change. With the exception of God, however, since we can never fully understand him, it can appear that he changes, when it is really just our perspective of Him.

[DividedThigh]

upc in itself is a decent org, but there are people in it, and that is where the prob comes, the answere is obviously no, but there are some, by the way the upc aint god, Jesus is much holier and graceful than that, lol,dt