Should we teach others to rebel against Standards?

[1ofthechosen]

Deuteronomy 27:17 "Cursed be he that removeth his neighbour's landmark. And all the people shall say, Amen."

[Michael The Disciple]

Ok this taken literally would prove the anti beard,shave only Preachers are cursed. Dont remove the old landmarks?

Leviticus 19:27

You shall not round the corners of your heads neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard

This was the landmark SET BY JESUS CHRIST.Jesus is the one who gave the command in Lev. 19:27!

And YET.....todays modern Preachers will have nothing to do with it! Except to condemn it and preach that those who have a beard are rebellious!

To THEM its THEIR standard....throwing Christs standard under the bus! Shave off that unholy beard! Dont set foot on the holy platform until you get rid of that thing!

Dont tell us we need BIBLE to teach standards!

Hyperbole? May a tinge.

But did this Preacher not consider if he can preach from the OT about his neighbors landmark someone else can preach from it that if JESUS was God in the OT and he CONDEMNED shaving of beards?

[1ofthechosen]

No disrespect, but the beard has become your God. If you want to have a beard have one. Just you are going to have to find some leadership that preaches that way. I'm sure It can be done. I'm literally Laughing out loud, it seems like that's all that matters to some. It's like how women are with make up or something.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by 1ofthechosen

No disrespect, but the beard has become your God. If you want to have a beard have one. Just you are going to have to find some leadership that preaches that way. I'm sure It can be done. I'm literally Laughing out loud, it seems like that's all that matters to some. It's like how women are with make up or something.

But what about the old landmark?

Who are the REBELS?

[1ofthechosen]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Ok this taken literally would prove the anti beard,shave only Preachers are cursed. Dont remove the old landmarks?

Leviticus 19:27

You shall not round the corners of your heads neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard

This was the landmark SET BY JESUS CHRIST.Jesus is the one who gave the command in Lev. 19:27!

And YET.....todays modern Preachers will have nothing to do with it! Except to condemn it and preach that those who have a beard are rebellious!

To THEM its THEIR standard....throwing Christs standard under the bus! Shave off that unholy beard! Dont set foot on the holy platform until you get rid of that thing!

Dont tell us we need BIBLE to teach standards!

Hyperbole? May a tinge.

But did this Preacher not consider if he can preach from the OT about his neighbors landmark someone else can preach from it that if JESUS was God in the OT and he CONDEMNED shaving of beards?

Ok well here we are your using this OT Mosaic law scripture. First off, are you Jew or Gentile? I believe your Gentile, so with that being said let's go to Acts 15:1-31. So to highlight the parts we are talking about go to verse 5-6: "But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses. [6] And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter." Some call this council of Jerusalem.

What was the outcome? Go with me to verse 23-24: "And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia: [24] Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment."
There you have it, we the Gentiles do not have to follow the law. Unless it's something God expressly says He hates, or it's and abomination, that never changes! For God never changes.

I found this quote from Martin Ballestero which said: "Did they have facial hair in the early days of Pentecostal outpouring in the 1900’s? Yes. Early Pentecostal pioneers such as Bro. Seymour and Bishop Haywood wore facial hair. We’ve seen the pictures.
However, in early Pentecost, especially in the white churches, there was a marked absence of beards. The beards seemed to disappear. Many Hispanic and black men feel that wearing a mustache is symbolic of masculinity. So automatically the cultural thing is throw down like an non-debatable subject. Of course that debate ignores the church’s culture. During the Hippy Generation of the 50’s and 60’s, beards sprouted on those who rebelled against society. It became their symbol. Many of that culture were draft dodgers and some even moved to Canada. A spirit of rebellion and non-conformity was connected to the beard wearing. New male converts for years have shown visible evidence of their conversion, by shaving off their facial hair when they got into an Apostolic church. The Pentecostal scene was one of clean-shaven men for over 50 years."

[n david]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Ok this taken literally would prove the anti beard,shave only Preachers are cursed. Dont remove the old landmarks?

Leviticus 19:27

You shall not round the corners of your heads neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard

This was the landmark SET BY JESUS CHRIST.Jesus is the one who gave the command in Lev. 19:27!

And YET.....todays modern Preachers will have nothing to do with it! Except to condemn it and preach that those who have a beard are rebellious!

To THEM its THEIR standard....throwing Christs standard under the bus! Shave off that unholy beard! Dont set foot on the holy platform until you get rid of that thing!

Dont tell us we need BIBLE to teach standards!

Hyperbole? May a tinge.

But did this Preacher not consider if he can preach from the OT about his neighbors landmark someone else can preach from it that if JESUS was God in the OT and he CONDEMNED shaving of beards?

Mike, do you wear tassels on the four corners of your coat? Do you wear any foreign clothing? Do you wear clothing with mixed material?

You already said you trim your beard, so you're not following the law on that anyway.

So why are you claiming we should be following Lev 19 when you don't follow it yourself, nor do you follow any of the other laws regarding clothing?

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by n david

Mike, do you wear tassels on the four corners of your coat? Do you wear any foreign clothing? Do you wear clothing with mixed material?

You already said you trim your beard, so you're not following the law on that anyway.

So why are you claiming we should be following Lev 19 when you don't follow it yourself, nor do you follow any of the other laws regarding clothing?

I was trying to show the folly of the preaching video. Remove not your neighbors landmark. His message was straight from the OT. Get it? So if he is going to take his message straight from the OT about keeping another mans standards what about Jesus standards?

Was he not the God of Leviticus 19:27? Did HE not set THAT STANDARD?

I do not teach commandments from Moses law. Im just showing the double STANDARD that was in play in the message.

[1ofthechosen]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

I was trying to show the folly of the preaching video. Remove not your neighbors landmark. His message was straight from the OT. Get it? So if he is going to take his message straight from the OT about keeping another mans standards what about Jesus standards?

Was he not the God of Leviticus 19:27? Did HE not set THAT STANDARD?

I do not teach commandments from Moses law. Im just showing the double STANDARD that was in play in the message.

What are you saying you can't preach from the OT? He just used that scripture because it has a lot to do with people in a liberal mind state. He's not telling you to follow the law, what you are trying to say with Leviticus 19:27 is follow a law. He was only using a principal from the Word of God. Using a principal is different, then looking for a reason to get around a standard that's set. I got a question do you go to a church, do you have a man of God? Are you a man under authority, do you have a problem with submitting?

[Michael The Disciple]

During the Hippy Generation of the 50’s and 60’s, beards sprouted on those who rebelled against society. It became their symbol. Many of that culture were draft dodgers and some even moved to Canada. A spirit of rebellion and non-conformity was connected to the beard wearing. New male converts for years have shown visible evidence of their conversion, by shaving off their facial hair when they got into an Apostolic church.

This is the ridicuous tradition that brought in Preachers war against beards. So the hippies were sinners and wore beards? First off many hippies did not wear beards. Secondly we could ask did other men BESIDES hippies wear a beard in the 60's and 70's?

And yet here is the most HYPOCRITICAL thing about the whole mess. The shave only Preachers say they are keeping people from the world by preaching against beards. They say they have a rebellious spirit (I suppose this means demonic) if they want to wear a beard!

But what about the Preachers nice suits? In our society there are VERY WICKED MEN who are out there wearing suits! Think about it.

Corrupt politicians.
Wall Street kings of greed.
CIA agents who overthrow governments and assasinate people.
Hollywood actors known for fornication and worldliness.

These all have something in common. They all wear suits!

And YET.....the shave only Preachers not only never target these suit wearing sinners but actually follow right along with the stylishness and worldliness! How can we take this line of reasoning about beards seriously from Preachers who wear the same suits as the most worldly of all society wears?

But O yes they are worried about the WORLD sneaking into the Church.

But oh yes dont forget to preach about those evil beards. Someone might be tempted to think the Bible is ok with them!

And in these so called Apostolic Churches it is actually considered evidence of being saved when one SHAVES!

Well judging by the same standard that the beards were worn by some hippies therefore beards are wicked can we not make it a sign of TRUE CONVERSION if a Preacher or Church members takes off their suits?

I mean we "Apostolics" would not want the air of worldliness among us right? And what is more worldly than Hollywood? Wall Street? CIA? Corrupt politicians?

So I guess they really are not very serious about THE WORLD COMING INTO THE CHURCH!

Nope. As long as they can get by with preaching that men who wear beards have a SPIRIT OF REBELLION....they have done their duty.

[1ofthechosen]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Corrupt politicians.
Wall Street kings of greed.
CIA agents who overthrow governments and assasinate people.
Hollywood actors known for fornication and worldliness.

These all have something in common. They all wear suits!

Michael, this is a severely dramatic statement. Funny but dramatic. I believe people should be modest In apparel. There is cheap suits you know? I don't own a suit, I just wear button down and slacks. You missed the whole purpose of the quote of Martyn Ballestero. I quoted it for the part where he said: "However, in early Pentecost, especially in the white churches, there was a marked absence of beards. The beards seemed to disappear." And the other part where he said: "The Pentecostal scene was one of clean-shaven men for over 50 years."

That's what I've been saying, if it's been like that for 50 years who am I to come in, and tell them to change for me? What they are saying isn't immoral, their not telling you to sacrifice your children!!! I understand you feel that people are saying you have a demon because you have facial hair. Or that your rebellious because of it. I don't believe someone is rebellious for having it. But, I do believe if you go to a church that preaches against it, and you are going around to other people trying to get them to rebel against it that is rebellious. There's a root in a lot of this, that's the spirit of Absalom at work. If you can't take it, go to a church where it is accepted to have a facial hair. We all need to have a man of God though, because without that, who's going to call you out on your stuff?