Rick Warren Statement - Page 3

ForeverBlessed · #21 01-12-2010, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

Churches can have numbers,but you just have numbers and not true Christians what do you have ? A big social club or something.

well, since you have brought this up… you linked to a friend that I went to school with on FB… he goes to a fairly large church that runs about 1,500 people here in my city. Considering the city is only about 15K, that is large for here. He has quite a testimony. The church is growing and is only about 10 years old. They are growing because excited people are inviting because of the changes in their lives and what God has done for them.

Actually two of my friends attend there… and they are on fire for God. In the last several months, they have managed to get me attending one of their weekly services. My friends spend more time at church and bible studies than most Apostolics. They have a daily prayer life and are living for God. I have gotten to know many of the people from that church in the last month. I have realized it is like any other church, you will have a core group of people who are dedicated to the church and their faith and making it a great place of worship. Likewise, you will have people who attend but aren’t as dedicated…what you will find is love for all people and encouragement to continue on.

I have heard ever since it was started years ago, that it is just a social group…blah, blah, blah…Just in the short time that I have been attending, I know why people are changing…because they are being taught the word of God and learning how to live according to the bible. Amazing, the way it should be.

People have to start somewhere…. we are on the same path, I am thankful for the churches offering a place for people to learn, heal and grow spiritually.

crakjak · #22 01-12-2010, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

Churches can have numbers,but you just have numbers and not true Christians what do you have ? A big social club or something.

Small churches are just as guilty of the statment you make Scott, so what is the purpose of the statment?

If a big church has the same percentage of "true christians" as the small church, which one is doing more for the kingdom?

Isn't this just the condition of humanity in general and we find it wherever we go??

Jeffrey · #23 01-12-2010, 09:36 AM

I think Scott's concerns are valid.
Many today are results driven. We should first ask what Jesus said we should do, results or no results. Secondly, once our heartbeat is right, we can work on ways to "Compel them to come." More than a church set on growth, is a church passionate about the Gospel. For a healthy church, growth is a byproduct.

Aquila · #24 01-12-2010, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notofworks

But the cat's already out of the bag. The horse is out of the barn. The train has left the station. The plane has gone down the runway (I can keep this up for a while). In court it would be said, "But you raised the issue", so come on, let's finish it. You said a large church is sometimes just a social club and a crowd can just be people that aren't "True Christians." So back it up and give me an example of a church that fits that description.

What church do you attend Notofworks?

rgcraig · #25 01-12-2010, 09:43 AM

Lisa,

Great post! I think it's so sad that some feel just because it's not a hoe down that God isn't there.

notofworks · #26 01-12-2010, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquila

What church do you attend Notofworks?

I'll PM you.

crakjak · #27 01-12-2010, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForeverBlessed

well, since you have brought this up… you linked to a friend that I went to school with on FB… he goes to a fairly large church that runs about 1,500 people here in my city. Considering the city is only about 15K, that is large for here. He has quite a testimony. The church is growing and is only about 10 years old. They are growing because excited people are inviting because of the changes in their lives and what God has done for them.

Actually two of my friends attend there… and they are on fire for God. In the last several months, they have managed to get me attending one of their weekly services. My friends spend more time at church and bible studies than most Apostolics. They have a daily prayer life and are living for God. I have gotten to know many of the people from that church in the last month. I have realized it is like any other church, you will have a core group of people who are dedicated to the church and their faith and making it a great place of worship. Likewise, you will have people who attend but aren’t as dedicated…what you will find is love for all people and encouragement to continue on.

Quote:

I have heard ever since it was started years ago, that it is just a social group…blah, blah, blah…Just in the short time that I have been attending, I know why people are changing…because they are being taught the word of God and learning how to live according to the bible. Amazing, the way it should be.

My exact discovery when we moved outside the box thirty years ago.

People have to start somewhere…. we are on the same path, I am thankful for the churches offering a place for people to lean, heal and grow spiritually.

As you, we should all rejoice with all that call on the name of the Lord. He is at work, and will do His purpose wherever folks hearts are turned toward Him and are hungry to know HIM.

Aquila · #28 01-12-2010, 09:54 AM

The Great Commission is about advancing the Kingdom of God. It's not about gathering members for a congregation. The Kingdom of God is composed of people. Technically, God's called out (the church) is also composed of people. Our church services and church buildings are primarily just "schools" of instruction in the Kingdom of God. One need not attend "church" as we know it to be a genuine Christian. However, attending a church congregation will assist with spiritual growth, understanding, education, fellowship, and discipleship. We can expand the Kingdom of God by witnessing daily, praying with those willing to pray anywhere we go. Worship isn't just three songs before offering... worship is a way of life. You can "worship" by following the Spirit of the Lord into a Boston Stoker on your day off and waiting there to share Christ with the soul that God leads to you. You can "worship" while fishing on the lake in the scerene atmosphere of the wilderness, purple mountains, and blue sky... all painted by the very hand of God. You can "worship" while reading a book. You can "worship" while playing with your children. When you do anything in a manner that is dedicated to God's glory it is "worship". In fact all daily tasks or activities of life can be "worship" if their purpose is to glorify God in the moment, every moment.

I fear we think growing a "church" is our mission sometimes. I also fear that we've replaced genuine worship with "song service" and anointing with talent. We think worship is something done in the church building wherein we raise our hands, maybe dance a jig, rattle off our "prayers" with religious vibrato, cheer the preacher, and listen to the sermon. While all of those things "can be" worship... they do not define worship. The most intense "worship" I've had lately was with a friend at their house. You see, we have a My Utmost For His Highest devotional by Oswald Chambers. We read it in the quiet of the living room and then talked about it, allowing the Holy Spirit to guide the conversation. We talked and shared truths and deep things about the Lord for well over an hour and a half. The presence of God was so strong we felt like weeping. All we did was read a devotional, a passage of Scripture, and talk about Jesus all to the glory of God. That was... worship.

Don't know why I felt drawn to the subject of worship here... I feel the Spirit pushing me that direction. Maybe someone here hasn't worshipped in a while or has a misguided notion of what worship is? I don't know... but I typed as I felt impressed to share.

Back to the subject...

Let's advance the Kingdom of God for the sake of souls, their salvation, enrichment, and freedom... NOT to add numbers to a church building.

BeenThinkin · #29 01-12-2010, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgcraig

Lisa,

Great post! I think it's so sad that some feel just because it's not a hoe down that God isn't there.

So, let me see! If it's a social club then people should not come. But what if they accidentally find a seed sown in their heart in that church. Sure wouldn't have been sown if they were at the bar instead of the "social club church." And I agree rg. Some churches might not be a social club, per se, but they're going to run and scream and jump the pews regardless of who it scares away. (They're gonna have a good time regardless of who goes to hell.) I think I'll post a thread on what is considered "the presence of God."