The Plight of the Liberal:

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Sabellius

No, I am not ultra-con. But I am like Sojourner Truth:

Truth is powerful and therefore arguments from an authoritarian viewpoint cannot withstand it for long ... because Truth always has the final word.

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Brad Murphy

Just living in East Texas gives him a couple of ultra-con points...

That and puff pieces like this gets high fives from the JP crowd.

[JN Anderson]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

Once again we go to the ethereal world of "what ifs" and "may happen"

Imagine if your thinking on the dangers of seeking freedom would have been heeded during our colonial rule ... slavery ... segregation ...

The powers that be in the struggle for control have always used arguments like these to maintain there control.

Is it too much for a scholar such as yourself to question the soundness and validity of a paradigm, a rule, or tradition in light of the ultimate authority ... God's Word?

DA, I am wondering if you even read what I posted fully. I think you are bent on your own way and this post tends to prove that. For example, I clearly stated that the issue is when freedom is supposed to mean you are self-autonomous. Is this what you are arguing with? Yes or no.

[JN Anderson]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

Truth is powerful and therefore arguments from an authoritarian viewpoint cannot withstand it for long ... because Truth always has the final word.

Truth will always prevail, for sure. Truth makes way for authority. In fact, in the most general sense it will refer you to God.

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Sabellius

DA, I am wondering if you even read what I posted fully. I think you are bent on your own way and this post tends to prove that. For example, I clearly stated that the issue is when freedom is supposed to mean you are self-autonomous. Is this what you are arguing with? Yes or no.

Yet you equate liberal thinking to wanting to be self-autonomous ... you can't have both ...

In our circles these terms have been defined by certain criteria ... and in our sub-culture there is a value placed on not "listening to the man of God in your life" ... even if he's wrong or teaching false doctrine.

Neither liberals, moderates or conservatives who love God's Word ... and want to obey it ... view themselves as self-autonomous ... yet we all struggle w/ it.

This is where your thinking, IMO, breaks down

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Sabellius

Truth will always prevail, for sure. Truth makes way for authority. In fact, in the most general sense it will refer you to God.

Exactly ... the ultimate authority ... His Word ... not some man that says I can't have intimacy with my spouse on a church day... or that articles of clothing will send me to hell ... or are even "holy".

Being a liberal in our context .... does not mean the Word is ignored in the name of self-autonomy ... I argue that the liberal in our context loves the Word so much that he/she seeks to return to it as the final authority.

[JN Anderson]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

That and puff pieces like this gets high fives from the JP crowd.

Do you feel bitter about something? I notice you seem to have this chip on your shoulder quite a bit.

[SDG]

There are conservatives that seek self-autonomy in many other areas ... as liberals ... what you describe is not an ideological problem but a sin problem ... one that seeks to rebel against God and relies on self-sufficiency.

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Sabellius

Do you feel bitter about something? I notice you seem to have this chip on your shoulder quite a bit.

A lot better ... I'm sure this piece went well or will go well over there.

[Ferd]

I thought it was quite nice.


thanks Sabdude.