Pastors move to withhold/lessen SFC offerings in protest of NAYC

[Theresa]

*shakes head*


pathetic....and really sad.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Michael Phelps

I was also a licensed minister in the UPCI for 20 years. I can tell you that I heard over and over, "It's your responsibility to give the money, God will deal with the recipients if it's being misused and mismanaged".

I believe my analogy is on target, because I pastored for a number of years, and felt the sting of withheld offerings if I preached something that stepped on someone's toes. However, the fact that my income was affected by something that I did that others didn't agree with did not just affect me - it affected my family, innocent bystanders, if you will.

So, for me to with hold money from missionaries, innocent bystanders, because I didn't agree with what happened at a youth congress would fall into the same category.

That reminds me of Sheriff Buford T Justice saying to his son to remind him when they get back to slap his mother (because the son was a moron)

[CC1]

Originally Posted by BobDylan

The REAL sign of the times is what went on at NAYC....

The UPCI is headed in the wrong direction my friend....

I know pastors, who instead of routing their monies through UPCI foreign missions (and having about 2/3 taken out for "administrative costs") are sending their monies directly to the missionaries themselves, and they are receiving 100% of the money, instead of just 1/3....

JMHO

I find your statistics extraordinary. Do you have proof that 2/3 of missionary offerings and support is spent on admin? I think you are blowing smoke and don't have a clue as to what you speak.

As my prescription drug addicted friend Rush Limbaugh says "words matter". I think you are just flinging around numbers that bear no resemblence to reality.

[rgcraig]

Originally Posted by deacon blues

Don't have time to read this whole thread, but the above paragraph contains a GROSS OVERSTATEMENT concerning the percentage that WEC keeps for administrative costs.

2/3 of the giving is 66% of what comes in. I thought I remembered that the figure is somewhere between 10-15%. That is not extravagant---its a reasonable percentage to cover the costs of running the FMD and to pay its staff. We would not have the effective missions program without the adminstrative work done by FMD.

It is sad that worthwhile ministries will suffer for the wrong headed choices of protesters of the NAYC. Its highly unethical. I don't believe God is pleased with it either. Send your complaint to WEC via email or phone or snail mail, but this sitting on funds raised is ridiculous.

Jesus taught us to give expecting nothing in return.

There is a really bad spirit growing in our movement and its stinks in the nostrils of God. I pray the Lord will have mercy on such spirits. Sowers of discord aren't highly regarded in the Scripture. In fact the book of Proverbs says that the Lord "hates" those that sow discord among brethren.

Note, He not only hates the sowing of discord, He hates those who sow the discord.

That's a pretty serious violation in my book.

CC1 - this is more accurate.

[CC1]

Originally Posted by rgcraig

CC1 - this is more accurate.

I know that it is. The Foreign Missions division has been one of the shining stars of the UPCI and I am not going to stand by and let someone throw out grossly wrong numbers impuning it like Mr. Dylan did.

[BrotherEastman]

Originally Posted by CC1

I know that it is. The Foreign Missions division has been one of the shining stars of the UPCI and I am not going to stand by and let someone throw out grossly wrong numbers impuning it like Mr. Dylan did.

What gets me is the fact that he stated "I am not in the UPC, nor do I plan to be".

Originally Posted by CC1

I know that it is. The Foreign Missions division has been one of the shining stars of the UPCI and I am not going to stand by and let someone throw out grossly wrong numbers impuning it like Mr. Dylan did.

The FMD has its skeletons just like any other group. But that is another subject for another time. :sshhh

[BrotherEastman]

Originally Posted by Joseph

The FMD has its skeletons just like any other group. But that is another subject for another time. :sshhh

Does it now?

[CC1]

Originally Posted by Joseph

The FMD has its skeletons just like any other group. But that is another subject for another time. :sshhh

It is far from perfect but over the history of the UPC the Foreign Missions division has done more with less money than any other FMD of any evangelical denomination that I know of.

It is one thing to discuss some legitimate beefs with the FMD but to throw out grossly inaccurate numbers as if they are fact is inexcusable.

That plants a seed of doubt in peoples minds that should not be there and of course that 2/3 figure will stick in some peoples head and become a "fact" even though it is not true.

This seems akin to the Democrats tactic of believing that if they repeat some outrageous lie enough times people will believe it is fact.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Joseph

The FMD has its skeletons just like any other group. But that is another subject for another time. :sshhh

Then why even mention it?