UPC Pastor Convicted of Slander in Pulpit!

[OilCityCajun]

Actually, I wouldnt say I am mortified...It's a sign of the times. But as a technical point, this wasnt in public. This was in the privacy of the friend's home. 1 Married woman and 1 married man...married to someone else...apparently with neither spouse nor any other 3rd party present. Adultery? Absolutely not, but surely you wouldn't argue that there was absolutely nothing improper about it. Would you be poolside in a bikini with a married man when no one else is present?

Bear in mind, this in no way excuses the pastor. As I see it, he is equally sinful for justifying an unscriptural divorce as the woman in the bikini.

Originally Posted by mizpeh

I predict you will get pm's from earnst-while UPC preachers to advise you not to post on AFF or it may affect your licensing.

It may, and I have considered this. But I dont see how it would, considering the fact that I am standing up for UPC edict against deliberate misinterpretation. What will definately present a much larger problem is the fact that I am divorced. But in my case she was in her third trimester before she filed for divorce {EDIT} and of course the child isnt mine {/EDIT}, and I havent remarried, so I should be in the clear on that point.

And yet, if it does present a problem for the UPC, apparently it doesnt present a problem for God, as the call and annointing of God on my life to preach His word is as strong as ever.

[Michlow]

Originally Posted by OilCityCajun

Actually, I wouldnt say I am mortified...It's a sign of the times. But as a technical point, this wasnt in public. This was in the privacy of the friend's home. 1 Married woman and 1 married man...married to someone else...apparently with neither spouse nor any other 3rd party present. Adultery? Absolutely not, but surely you wouldn't argue that there was absolutely nothing improper about it. Would you be poolside with a married man when no one else is present?

You didn't quote me, but I am guessing this is in response to my post. Was it ever proven that there was no one else there? (I only read the first 55 pages of this thread) Or is it still conjecture?

I have no problem with men and women being friends or being alone together, marital status not withstanding. HOWEVER, I would say that one of the obvious problems with it is this very thing, everyone wonders about it.

I for the record, am still (even after losing 90 pounds) about 30 pounds too fat to get away with wearing a bikini. In addition I have already been "unbiblically" divorced. Thirdly, I don't believe my atheist boyfriend would find wearing a bikini to be scandalously immodest. So I'm not really sure my opinion of whether or not it was improper is worth anything.

For what it is worth; If I was married, or say my boyfriend did take issue with me having male friends, OR if said male friends were married and their wives took issue with it, I would arrange my behavior accordingly. (Out of love for my friends/boyfriend)

[missourimary]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

Ya, my "thoughts" exactly. Was she simply openly rebellious, or was she questioning? Or did she "question" and THEN rebel because she was told she was not SUB-mitttttttting <spit>?

Or did she have a few questions, heard tongues flapping and/or saw the witch hunt process acted out in a few situations, and decided she didn't want any more to do with a church that strained at gnats and swallowed camels. It may not have been rebellion at all. She may have merely been sorting things out after divorcing and leaving a church.

I believe that sometimes, we are so busy being good witnesses to the "world" that we forget to witness to each other. We put on a good show to "sinners", and we follow all the rules of dress. But if we truly loved one another or did unto others as we would have others do to us, we couldn't possibly say many of the things we say. We've learned that what we look like is much more important than what we sound like.

What's in our heart is more often displayed in our words and attitudes than our hair or hems.

[Ferd]

imjustsay'in



I hurt myself today
to see if I still feel
I focus on the pain
the only thing that's real
the needle tears a hole
the old familiar sting
try to kill it all away
but I remember everything
what have I become?
my sweetest friend
everyone I know
goes away in the end
and you could have it all
my empire of dirt

I will let you down
I will make you hurt

I wear this crown of thorns
upon my liar's chair
full of broken thoughts
I cannot repair
beneath the stains of time
the feelings disappear
you are someone else
I am still right here

what have I become?
my sweetest friend
everyone I know
goes away in the end
and you could have it all
my empire of dirt

I will let you down
I will make you hurt

if I could start again
a million miles away
I would keep myself
I would find a way

[MrMasterMind]

Originally Posted by Ferd

imjustsay'in



I hurt myself today
to see if I still feel
I focus on the pain
the only thing that's real
the needle tears a hole
the old familiar sting
try to kill it all away
but I remember everything
what have I become?
my sweetest friend
everyone I know
goes away in the end
and you could have it all
my empire of dirt

I will let you down
I will make you hurt

I wear this crown of thorns
upon my liar's chair
full of broken thoughts
I cannot repair
beneath the stains of time
the feelings disappear
you are someone else
I am still right here

what have I become?
my sweetest friend
everyone I know
goes away in the end
and you could have it all
my empire of dirt

I will let you down
I will make you hurt

if I could start again
a million miles away
I would keep myself
I would find a way

Hard to believe that song was not written, by or for him. It was without a doubt the most powerful song he ever recorded.

[Ferd]

Originally Posted by MrMasterMind

Hard to believe that song was not written, by or for him. It was without a doubt the most powerful song he ever recorded.

which is saying something because he had some powerful stuff.

that last album is chock full of songs like that.

[OilCityCajun]

Originally Posted by Michlow

You didn't quote me, but I am guessing this is in response to my post.

Correct

Originally Posted by Michlow

Was it ever proven that there was no one else there? (I only read the first 55 pages of this thread) Or is it still conjecture?

It is still conjecture, which is why I use phrases such as "from the details in the story" and "apparently".

Originally Posted by Michlow

I have no problem with men and women being friends or being alone together, marital status not withstanding. HOWEVER, I would say that one of the obvious problems with it is this very thing, everyone wonders about it.

Fair enough. From a UPC minister's point of view, that is exactly what makes 1 Thessalonians 5:22 (King James Version) applicable, and therefore the woman's actions inappropriate. However, I emphatically reiterate that the pastor was equally wrong, secularly and theologically, in stretching the definition of adultery to excuse the divorce and subsequent relationship.

Originally Posted by Michlow

I for the record, am still ...In addition I have...Thirdly, I don't believe...

So noted.

Originally Posted by Michlow

...So I'm not really sure my opinion of whether or not it was improper is worth anything.

Certainly it is! Your opinion is just as valid as mine or that of anyone else on this forum.

Originally Posted by Michlow

For what it is worth; If I was married, or say my boyfriend did take issue with me having male friends, OR if said male friends were married and their wives took issue with it, I would arrange my behavior accordingly. (Out of love for my friends/boyfriend)

So you agree, at least in part, that the woman was at fault. Seeing how, knowing full well the standards of the church and her husband's level of commitment to those teachings, she knew he would take offense and did it anyway. So from your perspective, what the pastor did would be far less egregious than from our perspective. Which begs the question: How do you feel about what the pastor did? Was it ok? Was it wrong only because it maligned the woman? Was it wrong only because it misrepresented UPC teachings? Was it wrong for both reasons? Was it wrong for reasons which have not yet been adequately presented?

[Charnock]

Even the title of this thread is wrong.

The pastor wasn't "convicted" of anything.

Talk about slander?

[DAII]

Originally Posted by DAII

By the way not sure this a "conviction" as stated in the thread title.

Originally Posted by Charnock

Even the title of this thread is wrong.

The pastor wasn't "convicted" of anything.

Talk about slander?

You are about 81 pages late.

[Hoovie]

One truth that has gone mostly unnoticed in this thread....

The majority of women's ability to be seductive is greatly diminished by wearing a bikini.

Nakedness, or near nakedness is not always what attracts the male gender...

Just sayin.