The Trouble With Apostolics is...

[houston]

Originally Posted by Charnock

I did.

Really?

[scotty]

Originally Posted by Charnock

"The movement loves standards of holiness more than the spirit of holiness."

I could name dozens of instances in which Apostolics follow a rule without following the spirit in which it was created.

Jewelry is evil, and will send you to Hell, but Apostolic women wear all sorts of beads and cheap jewels in their outlandish hairdos.
Never heard jewelry will send you to hell. But I don't care for all the big bow stuff in the hair either.


Going to organized sports events is wrong, but we can listen to it on the radio, watch it online, get in arguments about whose team is best, and wear MLB and NFL apparel.
No problems here. Most in our church go to sports events.

TV is evil, but Netflix, Vudu, Hulu and all of the other internet delivery systems are okay.
No problem. Most in my church have TV's, half go to movie theaters

Abortion is wrong, but the death penalty is okay.
This is a stupid comment. Its apples and oranges. If you cant see the difference between and innocent child and a convicted felon then.......

Non-tithers are Hell-bound, but tax cheats find mercy.
Never heard of going to hell for not tithing. Have heard that you live a more blessed life when you tithe, I can testify to that .

On and on and on.

Maybe you have been away too long. I know some would not recognize change if it slapped them in the face. They would prefer to go on hating for what it used to be. I actually asked someone here if they would go back if UPC made all the changes they wanted, they said "no, because they should have made them sooner". lol.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by scotty

Maybe you have been away too long. I know some would not recognize change if it slapped them in the face. They would prefer to go on hating for what it used to be. I actually asked someone here if they would go back if UPC made all the changes they wanted, they said "no, because they should have made them sooner". lol.

Good point!

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

Yes, indeed it is a broad brush, because of course not all churches are like that, and I would never want to say that. But there is enough of it that goes on, that for someone who has gone to a church like that, it is hard to get past that experience.

Thankfully, there are wonderful people here on AFF who can attest to the fact that there are churches where none of that takes place, and where moderation is a key factor.

But I have been in many church circles, and these not being just UPC, but other apostolic groups where if you were not moving during worship, the preacher would throw a songbook at you, and that indeed is a fact. Bro. Eply may know of the one preacher I speak of. He was known to do this. Every time I went to a service he was in, when he was playing the organ or accordian, you were always a little bit worried a songbook might come flying your way... lol!

The best services I have ever been in have been ones where you couldn't get to the altar fast enough, where a spirit of weeping, and intercession literally shook the building. Those were the services that brought about complete changes in my heart and life. The shouting, and hoop-la services seemed to last until you went out the door, and then there was a sort of emptiness in your heart later.

I have been in services where I could have stayed all night, if I could have, just laying on the altar weeping, and being in His presence, and a time of rejoicing would sometimes come after being in His presence like that, and that to me, was true worship. Dancing before the Lord with tears streaming down my face in love and adoration to Him, after my heart had been cleansed, and cleaned up at the altar.

Those are the kind of special times with the Lord that really did work a change in my life.

I would rather have that kind of worship any day, than the worked up, emotional frenzy that some seem to think is the only way God can move in a service (notice I said some, not all...)

Great post!

As far as the preacher throwing a song book at someone, did anyone dare to ever go all Randy Johnson on him and throw it back, aiming right for the strike zone? (That's what I would have done.)

And yes, I LOVE the services where conviction fills the room and everyone quietly collapses in prayer without all the artificially drummed up emotions of a pep rally.

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by Charnock

At most OP camps and conventions, the preacher is consistently drowned out by clapping. Every time he raises his voice the people stand and applaud.

He could say "The devil is god" and people would stand and applaud.

They're conditioned to do so.

And when the preacher talks about standards, and those who've left them? Oh my!

Then the crowd pumps their fists in the air cause they smell blood in the water.

Ya, that is typical camp service preaching, at least in ALL my experience. And mixed in it all is the ever present fashion show worthy of a Hollywood red carpet premier.

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by Charnock

"The movement loves standards of holiness more than the spirit of holiness."

I could name dozens of instances in which Apostolics follow a rule without following the spirit in which it was created.

Jewelry is evil, and will send you to Hell, but Apostolic women wear all sorts of beads and cheap jewels in their outlandish hairdos.

Going to organized sports events is wrong, but we can listen to it on the radio, watch it online, get in arguments about whose team is best, and wear MLB and NFL apparel.

TV is evil, but Netflix, Vudu, Hulu and all of the other internet delivery systems are okay.

Abortion is wrong, but the death penalty is okay.

Non-tithers are Hell-bound, but tax cheats find mercy.

On and on and on.

Dozens? Try hundreds.

(Although I have to say I am against abortion in most instances and FOR death in most cases that warrant it....)

[Hoovie]

Scotty's answers are pretty much the way I would answer about the church I attend.

[bbyrd009]

And he precisely demo's "premises revealed"
in the rest. Priceless.

The bottom line for an
Apo/Pent whiner is that they
are complaining about a church
that lots of people, apparently, love.

One might whine about that church, sure;
but prolly it brought you to God, and they will
even tell you, back at that church,
that God works in mysterious ways.