Accepting Him or Rejecting Him; Jesus Name Baptism and Pentecostal Trinity Churches

stmatthew · #1 03-04-2007, 11:24 AM

The bible says very specifically that those that are "led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God"(Rom 8:14). It also says that this Holy Ghost will "guide you into all truth" (John 16:13). I think most of us here agree that the correct method of baptizing in water is "in the Name of Jesus Christ". This is what makes us Apostolic, and separates us from others that claim the Pentecostal experience.

So why is it that most Pentecostal trinitarian churches reject water baptism in Jesus Name? Are they refusing to be led by the Spirit into all truth. Why is it that this fundamental, foundational doctrine is not being accepted by these that have received the Spirit?

Will God accept them if they do not follow the leading of the Spirit and accept the truth of water Baptism in Jesus Name?

whollyHis · #2 03-04-2007, 12:24 PM

St. Matt...I was lying in bed last night, thinking about this forum, and all of the conversations about the doctrine that have been presented,and I asked myself the question, "Why NOT be baptized in Jesus Name??" Folks will do everything else in His name- why wouldn't they want to be baptized in His name? I cannot fathom NOT desiring to have His name applied to my life. Is it because that's all I've ever known, or been taught?

Do other churches preach or teach the name of Jesus at all?? I have only been to a Church of God service one time, Apostolic church is all I know...

mizpeh · #3 03-04-2007, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whollyHis

St. Matt...I was lying in bed last night, thinking about this forum, and all of the conversations about the doctrine that have been presented,and I asked myself the question, "Why NOT be baptized in Jesus Name??" Folks will do everything else in His name- why wouldn't they want to be baptized in His name? I cannot fathom NOT desiring to have His name applied to my life. Is it because that's all I've ever known, or been taught?

Do other churches preach or teach the name of Jesus at all?? I have only been to a Church of God service one time, Apostolic church is all I know...

I wasn't raised apostlic. I was Catholic and then an atheist. When God opened my eyes to his existence as the God of the Bible, I searched to see if what was being taught was true. Jesus' name baptism is truth. It is more clear than the initial evidence of tongues doctrine. Those who don't accept it are holding onto their traditions (it's hard to admit all those who have gone before them were wrong) and not obeying the word of God.

stmatthew · #4 03-04-2007, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mizpeh

I wasn't raised apostlic. I was Catholic and then an atheist. When God opened my eyes to his existence as the God of the Bible, I searched to see if what was being taught was true. Jesus' name baptism is truth. It is more clear than the initial evidence of tongues doctrine. Those who don't accept it are holding onto their traditions (it's hard to admit all those who have gone before them were wrong) and not obeying the word of God.

good post

ManOfWord · #5 03-04-2007, 04:57 PM

From my experience with folks of the "trinitarian" persuasion, they don't see the difference. I think it is sincere ignorance for the most part. I have also had quite few folks who didn't have a clue as to what was said over them at their baptism or they automatically believed that they were baptized in Jesus' name.

I know in some places it is outright rejected, but I really don't think it is the majority.

crakjak · #6 03-06-2007, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whollyHis

St. Matt...I was lying in bed last night, thinking about this forum, and all of the conversations about the doctrine that have been presented,and I asked myself the question, "Why NOT be baptized in Jesus Name??" Folks will do everything else in His name- why wouldn't they want to be baptized in His name? I cannot fathom NOT desiring to have His name applied to my life. Is it because that's all I've ever known, or been taught?

Do other churches preach or teach the name of Jesus at all?? I have only been to a Church of God service one time, Apostolic church is all I know...

Other churches do preach and teach the name of Jesus, they just believe they take on His name when they confess in faith Him as Saviour. They pray to the Father in Jesus Name as scripture instructs, they just don't interpret scripture as OP's do. Many of them believe what they believe just as fervently as OP's believe what they believe, however most will not reject you as a brother or sister in Christ just because they disagree doctrinely. Why not accept them as brothers and sisters, then trust the Holy Spirit to complete anything that is lacking in them?

Brother Price · #7 03-07-2007, 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crakjak

Other churches do preach and teach the name of Jesus, they just believe they take on His name when they confess in faith Him as Saviour. They pray to the Father in Jesus Name as scripture instructs, they just don't interpret scripture as OP's do. Many of them believe what they believe just as fervently as OP's believe what they believe, however most will not reject you as a brother or sister in Christ just because they disagree doctrinely. Why not accept them as brothers and sisters, then trust the Holy Spirit to complete anything that is lacking in them?

Because their Jesus is not my Jesus. They deny Jesus is the Father. They deny Jesus is the Holy Ghost. In so doing, they have made another Jesus than that of the Bible. In order to be a brother, they must have the same Father, and they do not have my Father. They may say I am their brother, but I do not call them mine, because of the scriptures, as found in 2John 1:10-11, "If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him Godspeed: For he that biddeth him Godspeed is partaker of his evil deeds."

They can be fervant in their beliefs, and still be fervantly wrong. Trinitarians are not my brothers or sisters. They have a different God. One other thing to mention on this. John 8:24 says this, "I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins." Notice ion the King James that the word 'he' is in italics. It was added for clarity. But, the original says that unless one believes Jesus is the I AM, which means unless a soul believes Jesus Christ is God and God alone, then cannot be saved. Only God can forgive sins, and only God can save the soul.

sola gratia · #8 03-07-2007, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother Price

Because their Jesus is not my Jesus. They deny Jesus is the Father. They deny Jesus is the Holy Ghost. In so doing, they have made another Jesus than that of the Bible. In order to be a brother, they must have the same Father, and they do not have my Father. They may say I am their brother, but I do not call them mine, because of the scriptures, as found in 2John 1:10-11, "If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him Godspeed: For he that biddeth him Godspeed is partaker of his evil deeds."

They can be fervant in their beliefs, and still be fervantly wrong. Trinitarians are not my brothers or sisters. They have a different God. One other thing to mention on this. John 8:24 says this, "I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins." Notice ion the King James that the word 'he' is in italics. It was added for clarity. But, the original says that unless one believes Jesus is the I AM, which means unless a soul believes Jesus Christ is God and God alone, then cannot be saved. Only God can forgive sins, and only God can save the soul.

Gee can I quote you on this?

crakjak · #9 03-07-2007, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother Price

Because their Jesus is not my Jesus. They deny Jesus is the Father. They deny Jesus is the Holy Ghost. In so doing, they have made another Jesus than that of the Bible. In order to be a brother, they must have the same Father, and they do not have my Father. They may say I am their brother, but I do not call them mine, because of the scriptures, as found in 2John 1:10-11, "If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him Godspeed: For he that biddeth him Godspeed is partaker of his evil deeds."
They can be fervant in their beliefs, and still be fervantly wrong. Trinitarians are not my brothers or sisters. They have a different God. One other thing to mention on this. John 8:24 says this, "I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins." Notice ion the King James that the word 'he' is in italics. It was added for clarity. But, the original says that unless one believes Jesus is the I AM, which means unless a soul believes Jesus Christ is God and God alone, then cannot be saved. Only God can forgive sins, and only God can save the soul.

What doctrine is John speaking of? He is specifically speaking of the doctrine that Jesus The Christ has come in the flesh, the doctrine that the messiah has come. You are super-imposing your interruption into the context. Trinitarians do believe that Jesus is He that has come in the flesh. I am not trinitarian, but I will defend folks that I know are true believers in Jesus Christ.

sola gratia · #10 03-07-2007, 10:31 AM

Brother Price cannot defend his own position so I would not be to concerned about it - it is sad to think that some think in this manner