Senate Passes Health Care Bill.....

[NewWine]

Well my fellow Americans the Senate just passed Health Care Bill with a vote of 219 to 210. This was a very close vote and not all Democrats voted for this bill. Up next is the Reconciliation vote. It will be quite interesting to see what transpires next. One of the biggest issues with the Health Care Bill is that it includes a clause that is in support of abortion. My understanding is if the Reconciliation vote does not pass then the passing of the bill is all for naught. I think that this points out that once you pay your taxes you truly do not have a voice or control of what that tax money supports.

What say you all on these developments?

***UPDATE: The Republican's are trying to now kill the bill based on Section 2 of the bill (I believe it's Section 2) which deals with abortion. Things are getting very tense.

[NewWine]

Here are some interesting facts on this bill
Source: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_1...46-503544.html

Cost:

• $940 billion over ten years.

Deficit:

• Would reduce the deficit by $143 billion over the first ten years. That is an updated CBO estimate. Their first preliminary estimate said it would reduce the deficit by $130 billion over ten years. Would reduce the deficit by $1.2 billion dollars in the second ten years.
  Coverage:
• Would expand coverage to 32 million Americans who are currently uninsured.

Health Insurance Exchanges:

• The uninsured and self-employed would be able to purchase insurance through state-based exchanges with subsidies available to individuals and families with income between the 133 percent and 400 percent of poverty level.
• Separate exchanges would be created for small businesses to purchase coverage -- effective 2014.
• Funding available to states to establish exchanges within one year of enactment and until January 1, 2015.

Subsidies:

• Individuals and families who make between 100 percent - 400 percent of the Federal Poverty Level (FPL) and want to purchase their own health insurance on an exchange are eligible for subsidies. They cannot be eligible for Medicare, Medicaid and cannot be covered by an employer. Eligible buyers receive premium credits and there is a cap for how much they have to contribute to their premiums on a sliding scale.

Federal Poverty Level for family of four is $22,050

Paying for the Plan:

• Medicare Payroll tax on investment income -- Starting in 2012, the Medicare Payroll Tax will be expanded to include unearned income. That will be a 3.8 percent tax on investment income for families making more than $250,000 per year ($200,000 for individuals).
• Excise Tax -- Beginning in 2018, insurance companies will pay a 40 percent excise tax on so-called "Cadillac" high-end insurance plans worth over $27,500 for families ($10,200 for individuals). Dental and vision plans are exempt and will not be counted in the total cost of a family's plan.
• Tanning Tax -- 10 percent excise tax on indoor tanning services.

Medicare:

• Closes the Medicare prescription drug "donut hole" by 2020. Seniors who hit the donut hole by 2010 will receive a $250 rebate.
  
• Beginning in 2011, seniors in the gap will receive a 50 percent discount on brand name drugs. The bill also includes $500 billion in Medicare cuts over the next decade.

Medicaid:

• Expands Medicaid to include 133 percent of federal poverty level which is $29,327 for a family of four.
  
• Requires states to expand Medicaid to include childless adults starting in 2014.
  
• Federal Government pays 100 percent of costs for covering newly eligible individuals through 2016.
  
• Illegal immigrants are not eligible for Medicaid.

Insurance Reforms:

• Six months after enactment, insurance companies could no longer denying children coverage based on a preexisting condition.
  
• Starting in 2014, insurance companies cannot deny coverage to anyone with preexisting conditions.
  
• Insurance companies must allow children to stay on their parent's insurance plans through age 26.

Abortion:

• The bill segregates private insurance premium funds from taxpayer funds. Individuals would have to pay for abortion coverage by making two separate payments, private funds would have to be kept in a separate account from federal and taxpayer funds.
• No health care plan would be required to offer abortion coverage. States could pass legislation choosing to opt out of offering abortion coverage through the exchange. **Separately, anti-abortion Democrats worked out language with the White House on an executive order that would state that no federal funds can be used to pay for abortions except in the case of rape, incest or health of the mother. (Read more here)
  
  
  Individual Mandate:
• In 2014, everyone must purchase health insurance or face a $695 annual fine. There are some exceptions for low-income people.

Employer Mandate:

• Technically, there is no employer mandate. Employers with more than 50 employees must provide health insurance or pay a fine of $2000 per worker each year if any worker receives federal subsidies to purchase health insurance. Fines applied to entire number of employees minus some allowances.

Immigration:

• Illegal immigrants will not be allowed to buy health insurance in the exchanges -- even if they pay completely with their own money.

[Neck]

Many companies will go back to their insurance companies and buy into plan's that have higher deductibles, cop-pays for drugs. So they can save money from now until 2014 when the mandates for all of the law takes effect. Already our companies have been moving in that direction, and now this new law takes away the incentive to attract highly qualified workers by better benefits. After 2014 that will not be an option that any will consider as companies will all be complying with the law as a bare minimum. I would expect we will all see our Co-pays double or triple and our drugs as well from now until 2014. The other reason the economy stupid, companies are looking to save money in anyway they can!

[NewWine]

I do wonder if many military families will choose to stay in the military because of this. On the other hand I wonder how this will affect military health care, if it will at all. In the last seven years military health care for dependents has changed quite a bit. Companies are always looking to save a dime, especially when you start talking about benefits.

[OP_Carl]

Originally Posted by NewWine

Here are some interesting facts on this bill
Source: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_1...46-503544.html

Cost:

• $940 billion over ten years.

Deficit:
[LIST][*]Would reduce the deficit by $143 billion over the first ten years. That is an updated CBO estimate. Their first preliminary estimate said it would reduce the deficit by $130 billion over ten years. Would reduce the deficit by $1.2 billion dollars in the second ten years.
Abortion:
[LIST][*]The bill segregates private insurance premium funds from taxpayer funds. Individuals would have to pay for abortion coverage by making two separate payments, private funds would have to be kept in a separate account from federal and taxpayer funds.

Your tag line says 'speaker of truth.' Yet your post was a regurgitation of an official government statement via CBS.

The CBO estimates continue to allow on-budget and off-budget items in their accounting methods, so programs are deemed affordable or excessive mostly on whimsy. $940 Billion would not even make a down payment on the true cost this program will incur, and there will be real deficit increases, not reductions. All who like the concept of nationalized health care would be wise to review the official CBO estimates for MediCare, and compare them to the actual costs.

America's bond-holders and creditors have already done so, and have found our Ponzi scheme wanting. America's bond rating will crumble, and its rate of deterioration will be accelerated by the enactment of nationalized health care. There is nobody left to pay for this party but the taxpayer.

People can believe what they choose about how abortion will be handled. A good way of THINKING about it is to look at the nature of the individuals calling the shots: The most pro-death president in history, and the most pro-death (and Catholic!) house speaker in history. It doesn't matter one bit what they are SAYING now, thinking people will watch what they actually DO. Based on the individual records of support of our current leadership, they will find a way to ratchet up this grisly trade.


So, all of you apostolics, does a person of good moral conscience support the practice of abortion with their Federal taxes?

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by OP_Carl

So, all of you apostolics, does a person of good moral conscience support the practice of abortion with their Federal taxes?

Do you think the Romans in Jesus' times may have taken tax money and built temples and sacrificed to their gods? Was Jesus aiding and abetting in idolatry by telling his followers to give to Caesar what is Caesar's?

[Sam]

Originally Posted by OP_Carl

...
So, all of you apostolics, does a person of good moral conscience support the practice of abortion with their Federal taxes?

We already "support" all kinds of stuff with our tax dollars that we don't believe in.

Abortion is a legal procedure and it is a medically approved procedure.
If a person is a government employee and receives medical care through the government, that person in my opinion, should be allowed to have an abortion if she wishes.

[Light]

Originally Posted by NewWine

Well my fellow Americans the Senate just passed Health Care Bill with a vote of 219 to 210. This was a very close vote and not all Democrats voted for this bill. Up next is the Reconciliation vote. It will be quite interesting to see what transpires next. One of the biggest issues with the Health Care Bill is that it includes a clause that is in support of abortion. My understanding is if the Reconciliation vote does not pass then the passing of the bill is all for naught. I think that this points out that once you pay your taxes you truly do not have a voice or control of what that tax money supports.

What say you all on these developments?

***UPDATE: The Republican's are trying to now kill the bill based on Section 2 of the bill (I believe it's Section 2) which deals with abortion. Things are getting very tense.

The Senate didn't pass any thing last night it wasn't even in session. The HOUSE passed the health care bill despite the lies and misrepresentation by the Republicans.

[Ferd]

bad day for America. Good day for democrats.

[Twisp]

Originally Posted by Ferd

bad day for America. Good day for democrats.

Good day for Americans, since the majority voted for Obama.