Apostolic girls and sports

[Renee29]

For those of you that consider yourself moderates, do you allow your daughters to play sports (softball, soccer etc) and wear the team uniform? My husband and I differ in this area. Please explain your reasoning either way.

[Jack Shephard]

If my daugther were old enough I would let her. That being said it would also depend if I could trust who she is. If she is mature enough then yes. I played sports growing up and I am better cause of it. I hope she will have the same opportunities. As far as dress code go it depends on if I believed they were modest. If it is a basketball deal with a jersey and shorts I would be fine with the shorts but the jersey would need to be modest too. All things considered I would let her. This would be the same if I had a boy too.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Renee29

For those of you that consider yourself moderates, do you allow your daughters to play sports (softball, soccer etc) and wear the team uniform? My husband and I differ in this area. Please explain your reasoning either way.

My daughters have both played basketball, and Sarah is playing again this year. We let them wear the team uniform, because the shorts are knee length and loose, and they wear plain white t-shirts under the top. We did request a couple sizes up in the shorts so they would be long and loose (they cinch up at the waist with a drawstring). So they don't look much different than culottes.

Our reasoning is: they need the physical activity, team sports teach a lot of good lessons, and they can learn to be modest in whatever they do. I do insist on modest uniforms, single-gender activities (if the uniforms aren't modest, such as in gymnastics), and if that isn't possible, another activity can be chosen.

However. If you teach your children that it is a sin to wear pants or shorts at all (if you're a girl), then it would be inconsistent to allow it for sports, in my opinion. We approach it differently in our house, with modesty being the overall theme, and gender distinction playing a secondary but still important role. I don't believe particular items of clothing are sinful across the board, nor are various stages of dress or undress. What is appropriate or not depends on the circumstance. If you approach it from the opposite end of the spectrum, ruling out specific items of clothing, then you can't then approach it from the other perspective without confusing your children.

[Renee29]

I will not be teaching my daughter that it's a sin to wear pants. My attitude is very similar to yours regarding the pants issue.

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

My daughters have both played basketball, and Sarah is playing again this year. We let them wear the team uniform, because the shorts are knee length and loose, and they wear plain white t-shirts under the top. We did request a couple sizes up in the shorts so they would be long and loose (they cinch up at the waist with a drawstring). So they don't look much different than culottes.

Our reasoning is: they need the physical activity, team sports teach a lot of good lessons, and they can learn to be modest in whatever they do. I do insist on modest uniforms, single-gender activities (if the uniforms aren't modest, such as in gymnastics), and if that isn't possible, another activity can be chosen.

However. If you teach your children that it is a sin to wear pants or shorts at all (if you're a girl), then it would be inconsistent to allow it for sports, in my opinion. We approach it differently in our house, with modesty being the overall theme, and gender distinction playing a secondary but still important role. I don't believe particular items of clothing are sinful across the board, nor are various stages of dress or undress. What is appropriate or not depends on the circumstance. If you approach it from the opposite end of the spectrum, ruling out specific items of clothing, then you can't then approach it from the other perspective without confusing your children.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Renee29

I will not be teaching my daughter that it's a sin to wear pants. My attitude is very similar to yours regarding the pants issue.

I will say this, Renee: My husband and I come to an agreement before our kids participate in anything, sports, extra-curricular, etc. If we can't reach an agreement, it doesn't happen. The kids can always take part in something else.

We make sure we discuss cost, scheduling (you know, some games may be on church nights--that's a big no-no around here), what they will wear, etc., out of the kids' earshot, and once we've made a decision, the kids find out one way or the other, without pinpointing the parent who made the "negative vote", if any. In other words, if my husband said no basketball, I wouldn't tell my kids, "Well, honey, I would let you play, but your Daddy said 'No' because he doesn't want you wearing shorts." (I'm not saying you would--just giving an example.) It's more along the lines of, "We discussed it and WE decided against it, but you can participate in __________ instead."

My husband has his own convictions, and I try my best to let him have the final say when we disagree. (It's NOT always easy!) I think it's a good lesson for our children to learn to respect authority, and realize their father has their best interests at heart, even when they may not like the decision. A much more important lesson than what they will learn from playing a few games of basketball. And, for that matter, you can always suggest that your husband take them to the park once every week or two and play a few games one on one or with some of their friends. Tag along, provide snacks, and make it fun.

I guess I'm just saying: I understand, been there, and if you can't agree, present a united front to your kids anyway--and let them find another, more appropriate or agreeable activity.

[Renee29]

That's good advice. Neither my husband or myself were raised in church. I went to school with UPC girls all my life so I know what the "norm" is regarding sports, gym etc. My husbands views are much more open than mine. He finds it ludicrious to not let girls play sports because of the clothing. He thinks I'm too fundamentalist and I'm going to "warp" her.

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

I will say this, Renee: My husband and I come to an agreement before our kids participate in anything, sports, extra-curricular, etc. If we can't reach an agreement, it doesn't happen. The kids can always take part in something else.

We make sure we discuss cost, scheduling (you know, some games may be on church nights--that's a big no-no around here), what they will wear, etc., out of the kids' earshot, and once we've made a decision, the kids find out one way or the other, without pinpointing the parent who made the "negative vote", if any. In other words, if my husband said no basketball, I wouldn't tell my kids, "Well, honey, I would let you play, but your Daddy said 'No' because he doesn't want you wearing shorts." (I'm not saying you would--just giving an example.) It's more along the lines of, "We discussed it and WE decided against it, but you can participate in __________ instead."

My husband has his own convictions, and I try my best to let him have the final say when we disagree. (It's NOT always easy!) I think it's a good lesson for our children to learn to respect authority, and realize their father has their best interests at heart, even when they may not like the decision. A much more important lesson than what they will learn from playing a few games of basketball. And, for that matter, you can always suggest that your husband take them to the park once every week or two and play a few games one on one or with some of their friends. Tag along, provide snacks, and make it fun.

I guess I'm just saying: I understand, been there, and if you can't agree, present a united front to your kids anyway--and let them find another, more appropriate or agreeable activity.

[Jack Shephard]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

My daughters have both played basketball, and Sarah is playing again this year. We let them wear the team uniform, because the shorts are knee length and loose, and they wear plain white t-shirts under the top. We did request a couple sizes up in the shorts so they would be long and loose (they cinch up at the waist with a drawstring). So they don't look much different than culottes.

Our reasoning is: they need the physical activity, team sports teach a lot of good lessons, and they can learn to be modest in whatever they do. I do insist on modest uniforms, single-gender activities (if the uniforms aren't modest, such as in gymnastics), and if that isn't possible, another activity can be chosen.

However. If you teach your children that it is a sin to wear pants or shorts at all (if you're a girl), then it would be inconsistent to allow it for sports, in my opinion. We approach it differently in our house, with modesty being the overall theme, and gender distinction playing a secondary but still important role. I don't believe particular items of clothing are sinful across the board, nor are various stages of dress or undress. What is appropriate or not depends on the circumstance. If you approach it from the opposite end of the spectrum, ruling out specific items of clothing, then you can't then approach it from the other perspective without confusing your children.

I have thought this way for a long time. I am a big time fighter against childhood obesity cause it creates health problems a too young of an age and thus bringing the life expectancy lower and lower. If we keep our kids from all the activities cause of dress code then I believe we are assisting in deepening the hole of childhood obesity. I like what you said about having an agreement before giving an answer. As parents our first responsibility is to our kids. If one can not make adjustments for their kids what can you do? Some people are too holy for their and their childrens good. There is always something that can be worked out.

I had a parent tell me once something along the lines of 'I will not let me kids be is sports cause of the dress code. They are spending the time that would have been given to sports and using it to study and getting smarter so they can get a great job and suppot me.' They were partly kidding, but I rebutted that it doesn't matter how book smart a kid is if they don't take care of their body which houses their brain then they have little chance. It does little good to have a great brain that you can use for 40 years when you could have had a great brain you could use for 80 years.

[Truthseeker]

I'd be careful with girls playing sports, it seems they can become masculinelike, IMO. Look at some women sports the way they walk, sit and so on.... to manly for me.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

I'd be careful with girls playing sports, it seems they can become masculinelike, IMO. Look at some women sports the way they walk, sit and so on.... to manly for me.

Oh, please. I didn't get to play team sports (competitively) as a kid, but I was a COMPLETE tomboy. Climbing trees, playing with boys all the time, basketball, volleyball, I always LOVED to be active. Now I love shoes (the high-heeled variety), feminine dresses, hankies with lace, and chick flicks--and I STILL love to play a good game of volleyball, or go "muddin'" on a 4 wheeler with my girlfriends if I get half a chance.

Femininity isn't threatened by team sports. It's threatened when women feel they have to act or dress like men in order to measure up. That's something good parenting can thwart.

I know quite a few Apostolic women who wear dresses all the time and have probably never even touched a softball who could learn a few lessons about femininity.

Or are you one of those guys who thinks women who sweat aren't feminine?

[Jack Shephard]

Originally Posted by Renee29

That's good advice. Neither my husband or myself were raised in church. I went to school with UPC girls all my life so I know what the "norm" is regarding sports, gym etc. My husbands views are much more open than mine. He finds it ludicrious to not let girls play sports because of the clothing. He thinks I'm too fundamentalist and I'm going to "warp" her.

Renee, you may not warp you child or you may--that goes for either direction you take it (the lib side or the con side). It should come dow to what is balanced living for this child. Is playing sports part of the balance or part of the unbalance? If it is only cause of clothing the leagues will mostlikely make an exception for a religious belief--if it is that important. I think the key is modesty and depending on the age of the child different things are modest than at other times. My 2 year old will wear a 2 piece bathing suit swimming now around both sexes but probably won't when she is old cause it would probably not be appropriate unless it is family or something. Ask what is balanced. Also ask if you are being too conservative and throwing weights on one side of the scale causing the weight to not balance.

quick story**

I was in Jr High and I went to the University of Tennessee basketball camp. The coach was Kevin O'Neil at the time. It was all male and so we played shirts and skins. I did not want to take off my shirt for a couple reasons. First I was not as fit as the others and felt I would get made fun of. Second because of what the church taught. I told the staff it was cause of my churches teachings. Kevin O'Neil and another coach said "What kind of F***ing religion is that?" I told them Pentecostal Christian. They made me sit out every game that we were deemed the skins team. So I didn't get to participate in most things. That was very tough to handle both not playing and getting asked that question. After that my parents started teaching me about the scriptures at home and instilling things in me that allowed me to become more spiritually mature.