Canadian Healthcare the real story

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

Another story to justify forcibly taking money from one person to give to another.

Evidently, you don't know how insurance works. Our premiums are so inflated because of all those who go to the ER and don't pay a dime because they don't have insurance. That loss is passed down in higher healthcare costs. To cover that, insurance companies have to increase their premiums.

So frankly, you're already being forced to pay for other people. Only, with the way you're being forced to pay, you also pay administrative costs with a bit of a profit margin tacked on.

Of course now we only have something like 48% who actually pay taxes, so it becomes easier to justify.

And just think... if we limited corporate subsidies, tax loopholes, and tax havens for just one of these multi-billion dollar corporations... their taxes alone would equal more than half of what working Americans are contributing.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Dordrecht

That would be free in Canada because it's included in the Medical Service Plan.

Nope, nope, nope. At age 30 in Canada, you do NOT get a colonoscopy, free or otherwise.

Here's a LINK to their guidelines.

In fact, they don't recommend the use of a colonoscopy as a screening tool for colon cancer at all.

"""•We recommend not using colonoscopy as a screening test for CRC."""

Adults 60-74 may receive a colonoscopy, depending on family history.

"""•We recommend screening adults aged 60 to 74 for CRC with FOBT (either gFOBT or FIT) every two years OR flexible sigmoidoscopy every 10 years.
(Strong recommendation; moderate quality evidence)"""

So, while this dad may use his dead son as a political prop (like most libs use dead relatives), he would not have received a colonoscopy in the healthcare utopia of Canada either.

"""Canadian guidelines say colonoscopy should not be used for routine screening to detect colorectal cancer in patients with no symptoms or family history of the disease."""

"""The Canadian guideline is similar to the 2008 U.S. Preventive Services Task Force recommendation that adults aged 50 to 75 should be screened for colorectal cancer using a fecal occult blood test or flexible sigmoidoscopy."""

http://globalnews.ca/news/2532426/ne...elines-issued/

[n david]

Originally Posted by Dordrecht

That would be free in Canada because it's included in the Medical Service Plan.

Have you read what's included or not included in the MSP? Apparently not. It does not cover colonoscopies.

Also interesting . . . Utopia doesn't include routine annual physical exams and doesn't cover PSA screenings either.

"""MSP does not provide coverage for the following:"""

"""preventive services and screening tests not supported by evidence of medical effectiveness (for example, routine annual "complete" physical examinations, whole body CT scans, prostate specific antigen (PSA) tests);"""

http://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/he...covered-by-msp

Not all sunshine and unicorns in Canada after all.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Here's something relevant to this discussion....

Every Tea Partier's utopia

"...we as a society refuse to extend care to all human beings, and 17,000 people die each year in states that have refused to expand Medicaid to cover people in poverty. In North Carolina alone, that number is 2,800. That's seven people a day. Seven human beings who were loved by their family and friends, just as my son was.

I helped organize a die-in this last week in Raleigh, and the eulogist, Rev. Dr. William Barber II, suggested we have open-casket funerals for the people who die from lack of care so people can see the result of our state's politicians' uncaring attitude toward the lives of the people they are supposed to be serving."

Main article:

An open casket


Oct 31, 2015 11:55am EDT by Lesboyd
Comment large177 621



This is the final photo of my son, taken six weeks before he died. I hate to even look at it, but there it is. He weighed about 104 -- and he would lose another 15 or so pounds before he finally starved to death.

I wasn't even going to save the photo because I prefer to remember my son as a healthy, funny, hyperactive clown. But this is what I live with now -- the memory of a gaunt, pain-wracked young man.

If Mike had been able to get the colonoscopies he needed, he would still be the person I want to remember.

Instead, we as a society refuse to extend care to all human beings, and 17,000 people die each year in states that have refused to expand Medicaid to cover people in poverty. In North Carolina alone, that number is 2,800. That's seven people a day. Seven human beings who were loved by their family and friends, just as my son was.

I helped organize a die-in this last week in Raleigh, and the eulogist, Rev. Dr. William Barber II, suggested we have open-casket funerals for the people who die from lack of care so people can see the result of our state's politicians' uncaring attitude toward the lives of the people they are supposed to be serving.

When Emmett Till was murdered in Mississippi in 1955, his mother decided on an open-casket funeral so people could see what had been done to her boy. Well, this is what was done to mine.

These legislators who refuse to expand Medicaid call themselves pro-life, but their policies prove otherwise. They care nothing for life once it has exited the birth canal. They care only about scoring political points, and as the body count mounts, they suffer no consequences for the lives they allow to be snuffed out.

A friend of mine said she wishes she believed in hell so she could picture them there. I just want the unnecessary deaths to stop.

So, I will make this photo public. This is what was done to my son. This is what happens to people who can't get access to the care they need.

In the end, we still pay for this care. My son's surgeries, chemo and radiation cost taxpayers nearly $1 million, when we could have saved his life for about $1,000 a year. When you allow someone to go without needed preventive care and chronic disease management, they become very sick -- and very expensive.

If you live in a state that has so far refused to expand Medicaid, your insurance rates could double -- or more -- this year. Don't blame Obama; blame the anti-lifers you elected to your state legislatures and governors' mansions. They have the care they need and always will, but they deny it to others.

You have the vote. You can send them home and replace them with people who do care.

Meanwhile, consider this photo and how unnecessary his suffering -- and that of those who loved and miss him -- was and is.

Source Link:http://m.dailykos.com/story/2015/10/...ege-looks-like

While this story is sad and it's heartbreaking to lose a loved one at a young age -- US healthcare was not to blame here. Colonoscopies are not allowed at age 30 for people with insurance in the US, nor are they used at age 30 in the Canadian healthcare utopia we read so much about.

No amount of using his dead son as a political prop will change the fact that he would have likely died in Canada with their "free" healthcare as well.

[n david]

Do you have a pre existing condition? If you do, Canadian healthcare might cover you. Then again, it might not.

"""It is very common for Canadians who apply for an individual health insurance plan to have one or more existing health problems or medical issues.

This article explains the options available to Canadians who find themselves in this situation.

Guaranteed Issue versus Medically Underwritten Health Insurance

Canadian private health insurance plans are either medically underwritten or they are guaranteed issue in nature.

Guaranteed issue plans are issued automatically with no medical questions to be answered.

There are also special guaranteed issue plans called “group conversion” plans, available if you have lost employee benefits coverage in the last 60 days.

Medically underwritten plans are “underwritten” by the insurance company. The applicant must answer medical questions that form part of the health insurance application. Additionally the applicant must give the insurance company permission to access their medical history and records.

It is important to know that medically underwritten plans offer more coverage (especially drug coverage) compared to guaranteed issue plans!

Possible Underwriting Results

When a health insurance plan is underwritten there are three possible results:

• Accepted: There is an offer of coverage with no exclusions.
• Counter offer: There is a counter offer of coverage with one or more exclusions regarding a pre-existing condition. In this case prescription drug coverage for that specific condition is excluded.
• Declined: The insurance carrier declines to cover you."""

http://www.insurance-canada.ca/consi...tions-1407.php

[n david]

Have you had a heart attack, and are looking for health insurance? Have you had cancer within the past decade? Have you had a stroke or have kidney or liver disease?

If this is you, don't bother with Sun Life Financial in Canada -- they won't cover your pre existing condition!

"""This is a partial list of common conditions that result in uninsurability for Personal Health Insurance, there may be other conditions that may also be uninsurable. Please do not submit a Personal Health Insurance application for coverage if you have one of these conditions. You can still submit a Health Coverage Choice application if you have one of these conditions and meet the Health Coverage Choice eligibility criteria.

• AIDS or tested positive for HIV
• Alzheimer's disease or dementia
• Aneurism (abdominal or aortic)
• Angina
• Anorexia nervosa/bulimia within the last five years
• Anxiety, depression or mood disorder resulting in recent hospitalization or time off work
• Cancer within the last ten years
• Cerebral palsy
• Congestive heart failure
• Coronary artery disease including bypass grafting
• Cystic fibrosis
• Down's syndrome
• Drug/alcohol abuse within the last five years
• Heart attack
• Heart valve replacement
• Hepatitis B, C, D
• Huntington's chorea
• Hydrocephalus
• Kidney disease
• Liver disease (chronic), including cirrhosis
• Major organ transplant
• Morbid obesity
• Multiple sclerosis
• Muscular dystrophy
• Pacemaker
• Paralysis treatment by angioplasty or coronary artery
• Parkinson's disease
• Peripheral vascular disease
• Schizophrenia
• Spina bifida
• Stroke (cerebral vascular accident) or TIA
• Systemic lupus erythematosus"""

https://www.sunlife.ca/ca/Insurance/...gnLocale=en_CA

Oh, Canada!

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by n david

While this story is sad and it's heartbreaking to lose a loved one at a young age -- US healthcare was not to blame here. Colonoscopies are not allowed at age 30 for people with insurance in the US, nor are they used at age 30 in the Canadian healthcare utopia we read so much about.

No amount of using his dead son as a political prop will change the fact that he would have likely died in Canada with their "free" healthcare as well.

No offence, but I believe that America will do better than Canada if we dedicated ourselves to this.

American tends to always end up leading the world.... when she finally wakes up.

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by Aquila

No offence, but I believe that America will do better than Canada if we dedicated ourselves to this.

American tends to always end up leading the world.... when she finally wakes up.

It will require a constitutional amendment.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by n david

Have you had a heart attack, and are looking for health insurance? Have you had cancer within the past decade? Have you had a stroke or have kidney or liver disease?

If this is you, don't bother with Sun Life Financial in Canada -- they won't cover your pre existing condition!

"""This is a partial list of common conditions that result in uninsurability for Personal Health Insurance, there may be other conditions that may also be uninsurable. Please do not submit a Personal Health Insurance application for coverage if you have one of these conditions. You can still submit a Health Coverage Choice application if you have one of these conditions and meet the Health Coverage Choice eligibility criteria.

• AIDS or tested positive for HIV
• Alzheimer's disease or dementia
• Aneurism (abdominal or aortic)
• Angina
• Anorexia nervosa/bulimia within the last five years
• Anxiety, depression or mood disorder resulting in recent hospitalization or time off work
• Cancer within the last ten years
• Cerebral palsy
• Congestive heart failure
• Coronary artery disease including bypass grafting
• Cystic fibrosis
• Down's syndrome
• Drug/alcohol abuse within the last five years
• Heart attack
• Heart valve replacement
• Hepatitis B, C, D
• Huntington's chorea
• Hydrocephalus
• Kidney disease
• Liver disease (chronic), including cirrhosis
• Major organ transplant
• Morbid obesity
• Multiple sclerosis
• Muscular dystrophy
• Pacemaker
• Paralysis treatment by angioplasty or coronary artery
• Parkinson's disease
• Peripheral vascular disease
• Schizophrenia
• Spina bifida
• Stroke (cerebral vascular accident) or TIA
• Systemic lupus erythematosus"""

https://www.sunlife.ca/ca/Insurance/...gnLocale=en_CA

Oh, Canada!

You actually posted a listing from a private insurer out of Canada? It's basically an advertisement. They are saying that Personal Health Insurance products, a supplemental form of insurance, can deny coverage for those conditions, and so they want to sell you their plan. This isn't even targeted at the rank and file Canadian who qualifies for full coverage under their Provincial system.

This isn't even Canada's healthcare plan.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Aquila

You actually posted a listing from a private insurer out of Canada? It's basically an advertisement. They are saying that Personal Health Insurance products, a supplemental form of insurance, can deny coverage for those conditions, and so they want to sell you their plan. This isn't even targeted at the rank and file Canadian who qualifies for full coverage under their Provincial system.

This isn't even Canada's healthcare plan.

It is Canadian healthcare. What you missed is the government does not cover all pre ex conditions, there are gaps in the coverage, which is why there is supplemental coverage available. However, even the supplemental coverage has exclusions.