I think Randy was more focused on the fact that this pastor is himself dissatisfied than criticizing the size of his church.
That is exactly right. And also focusing on the fact that he seems to feel he is in a rut -and may be. When a routine becomes too embedded, it usually needs to be shaken up from time to time.
How long should a pastor stay at a church under these circumstances?
He's been pastor for almost a decade.
- Membership is 30.
- There is minimal compensation and he works a secular job fifty hours a week.
- The church building is an embarrassment, but paid for.
- Started the church from nothing.
- He pays some of the church bills out of his own pocket.
- The church members are apathetic.
I've never pastored, so I can't really say what I would do.
I have at times felt like I'd lost my burden for leadership positions I was in and was desperately seeking direction from God.
At those times, I fasted and prayed and asked people who I knew were intercessors to pray with me until I got the answers I needed.
I would like to know if this situation is real or hypothetical. If it's real, I'd like to add this pastor to my prayer list.... or if he's already on my prayer list I would know specifically how to pray.
Maybe God wants him to use his own judgment. To use the mind He gave him, his common sense. To figure out what 2 plus 2 is, without waiting to hear God say "4".
God isn't always a puppet master. Is He?
God doesn't want him to be miserable. Does He?
The sad thing would be that any of the reasoning for anyone being miserable would simply be because their current situation didn't line up to what we are taught success is.
30 souls. Wow... how fantastic.
How wonderful is it to fellowship together with a this portion of the family of God and to say, when it is all said and done, that you had taught, led, helped and otherwise assisted 30 of God's children on their journey through this pilgrim land.
What a great thing to be proud of.
But this is viewed by far too many to be a "small work". That leads people to feel like underachievers for some terrible reason.
If anyone has ever ministered 30 people before they would know that it is no small task at all.
The sad thing would be that any of the reasoning for anyone being miserable would simply be because their current situation didn't line up to what we are taught success is.
30 souls. Wow... how fantastic.
How wonderful is it to fellowship together with a this portion of the family of God and to say, when it is all said and done, that you had taught, led, helped and otherwise assisted 30 of God's children on their journey through this pilgrim land.
What a great thing to be proud of.
But this is viewed by far too many to be a "small work". That leads people to feel like underachievers for some terrible reason.
If anyone has ever ministered 30 people before they would know that it is no small task at all.
It's more than just the numbers, it seems. But regardless, are you saying this fellow should just be happy where he is, no matter what?
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Hebrews 13:23 Know ye that our brother Timothy is set at liberty
It's more than just the numbers, it seems. But regardless, are you saying this fellow should just be happy where he is, no matter what?
No sir... Absolutely not. When one is not happy in a place it doesn't do them any good to stay nor does it do any good for those they are ministering to.
I'm just saying that it would be sad to know that this might be a scenario that they might have been pleased with except for a perceived pressure to be "successful" and have the big numbers and the fancy church building.
It would be disheartening to know that these expectations were instrumental in making a pastor displeased with such a great success.
Renda,
I didn't read the responses prior to posting this. This is my opinion: If the church has not grown in 10 years and the membership is not vested in it - then the Pastor needs to look at why he continues to hang on to the church. The secondary gains he gets for supporting this church could be: 1] His recognition as a Pastor, 2] Pride, or 3] He was self called and not God called.
This Pastor needs to search his heart and find out the true answer between he and God and then make adjustments where necessary.
Blessings, Rhoni
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhoni
Stephanas,
There is no one discounting faithfulness of the Pastor or Christ's multiplication. I am not sure why you are taking a defensive stance on this issue. Once again, I will say, the calling and direction of the Pastor is between he and God, not anyone on this forum.
It appears this issue is close to your heart. I think your posting is clouded by your perception as it applies to you. I intended no judgement in this matter that I know little to nothing about. An opinion was asked - I gave it.
Blessings, Rhoni
No judgement?
The Pastor was given a choice of the following options for his motivation in continuing "to hang on to the church."
The secondary gains he gets for supporting this church could be:
1] His recognition as a Pastor,
2] Pride,
3] He was self called and not God called.
So, he's either a glory hound, proud, or self called. Nice choice of options.
Defensive? Nice tactic. If I take issue with a belittling assessment of this hard working pastor's ministry, I'm defensive. You're only sharing an opinion, but I'm clouded over with personal issues?
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". . . as I suspect was true for those teaching Scriptures, I found that my students often felt they knew the Constitution without having really read it. They were accustomed to picking out phrases that they'd heard and using them to bolster their immediate arguments, or ignoring passages that seemed to contradict their views." Barack Obama in "The Audacity of Hope"
The sad thing would be that any of the reasoning for anyone being miserable would simply be because their current situation didn't line up to what we are taught success is.
30 souls. Wow... how fantastic.
How wonderful is it to fellowship together with a this portion of the family of God and to say, when it is all said and done, that you had taught, led, helped and otherwise assisted 30 of God's children on their journey through this pilgrim land.
What a great thing to be proud of.
But this is viewed by far too many to be a "small work". That leads people to feel like underachievers for some terrible reason.
If anyone has ever ministered 30 people before they would know that it is no small task at all.
That's exactly what I was trying to say.
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". . . as I suspect was true for those teaching Scriptures, I found that my students often felt they knew the Constitution without having really read it. They were accustomed to picking out phrases that they'd heard and using them to bolster their immediate arguments, or ignoring passages that seemed to contradict their views." Barack Obama in "The Audacity of Hope"
The sad thing would be that any of the reasoning for anyone being miserable would simply be because their current situation didn't line up to what we are taught success is.
30 souls. Wow... how fantastic.
How wonderful is it to fellowship together with a this portion of the family of God and to say, when it is all said and done, that you had taught, led, helped and otherwise assisted 30 of God's children on their journey through this pilgrim land.
What a great thing to be proud of.
But this is viewed by far too many to be a "small work". That leads people to feel like underachievers for some terrible reason.
If anyone has ever ministered 30 people before they would know that it is no small task at all.
I agree. It is a HUGE load to have 30 and work full time. This man is by no means a failure IF he is doing what he should be. But, the dissatisfaction is disconcerting. The question is why. And, yes, there are many who look down on a church of thirty (including pastors) and have no idea what they are talking about.
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Those who say it cannot be done should not interrupt the people doing it. ~Chinese Proverb
When I was young and clever, I wanted to change the world. Now that I am older and wiser, I strive to change myself. ~
The Pastor was given a choice of the following options for his motivation in continuing "to hang on to the church."
The secondary gains he gets for supporting this church could be:
1] His recognition as a Pastor,
2] Pride,
3] He was self called and not God called.
So, he's either a glory hound, proud, or self called. Nice choice of options.
Defensive? Nice tactic. If I take issue with a belittling assessment of this hard working pastor's ministry, I'm defensive. You're only sharing an opinion, but I'm clouded over with personal issues?
I agree. However, since Rhoni doesn't know who this person is I'm afraid she's using some of her past to view the situation through.
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