What would it take for you to get back into the UPC???

[Joelel]

Originally Posted by Carpenter

What would it take for you to get back into the UPC?

For me it would take a paradim change in the culture brought on by a change in the attitudes and perceptions of the entire organization toward mandating and defining a corporate holiness.

It would take the church giving holiness back to the saints of the living God for me to get back to it.

What I said is not very easy to reconcile, it has roots going to China...

Hi,For me to start fellowship with them,first change the name of the church.The Church in the word of God was never referred to as United Pentecostal church.Pentecost is a day not a church.Next start teaching all the truth.
Eph.5:3: But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;4: Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.5: For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God
Gal.5:19: Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,20: Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,21: Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God
1 Cor.6:9: Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,(Homosexuals)10: Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God
1 John3:3: And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.4: Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.5: And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.6: Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Carpenter

The problem with the UPC in terms of returning and/or remaining is that there is never a "FISH OR CUT BAIT" defining moment. They are neither right nor left on the continum and they cannot agree. Therefore they have their culture to define them, their look, their "separation. They have their rules, but even they acknowledge they are disobeyed and of none effect! What are they left with? An objective culture that keeps people in the separated social group.

The only momentous and decisive decision making time was in 1992, and there could very well be another on the horizon. But still there will be those who continue to hook bait, and tie flies, but they will never toss their line into the water.

THIS is why it would be difficult for me to return. It has become their nature, and a person's or more certainly an organization cannot change their nature.

Carpenter, in all due resepct, you put way too many absolutes in the above post for me to take it overly seriously.

Originally Posted by Sherri

I think everyone likes to think of himself/herself as moderate. Even the ultracons on here are liberals to the Amish or Mennonites. It's all a matter of perspective.

Precisely my point... We AGREE!!!!!

[Carpenter]

Originally Posted by rrford

Carpenter, in all due resepct, you put way too many absolutes in the above post for me to take it overly seriously.

Well, your respect taken in hand and heart, this was absolutely my opinion...maybe a little polarized, but not being polarized to an extent is kinda boring.

You have to admit there is a string of truth running through most every word in my post??

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Carpenter

Well, your respect taken in hand and heart, this was absolutely my opinion...maybe a little polarized, but not being polarized to an extent is kinda boring.

You have to admit there is a string of truth running through most every word in my post??

A tendril perhaps. I reckon the amazing thing is that ones view of the UPC is distinctly colored by the folks one spends their time with. For almost the last 2 years I have been in a different church almost every weekend. I have seen little of what you reference. Probably has somewhat to do with "Birds of a feather..."

[CC1]

Originally Posted by Joelel

Hi,For me to start fellowship with them,first change the name of the church.The Church in the word of God was never referred to as United Pentecostal church.Pentecost is a day not a church.Next start teaching all the truth.
Eph.5:3: But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;4: Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.5: For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God
Gal.5:19: Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,20: Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,21: Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God
1 Cor.6:9: Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,(Homosexuals)10: Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God
1 John3:3: And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.4: Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.5: And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.6: Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him

If you are inferring that the UPC does not meet the criteria of the scriptures you listed then you win the award for the most pretentious post on AFF.

[rrford]

Originally Posted by CC1

If you are inferring that the UPC does not meet the criteria of the scriptures you listed then you win the award for the most pretentious post on AFF.

Gotta agrre with your assessment. Waiting for the "Jeshua"requirement.

[Carpenter]

Originally Posted by rrford

A tendril perhaps. I reckon the amazing thing is that ones view of the UPC is distinctly colored by the folks one spends their time with. For almost the last 2 years I have been in a different church almost every weekend. I have seen little of what you reference. Probably has somewhat to do with "Birds of a feather..."

I would like to hear what you have seen sans the UPC rose colored glasses...(which of course asking this is a double standard on my part because you will say I was wearing blinders when I wrote my post)

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Carpenter

I would like to hear what you have seen sans the UPC rose colored glasses...(which of course asking this is a double standard on my part because you will say I was wearing blinders when I wrote my post)

Are you stating that you believe I view the organization throgh rose colored glasses?

[CC1]

Back to the question of this thread I think the following would have to occur for me to attend a UPC church again;

1. I would have to move to a town where there was no viable Oneness, Jesus
name baptizing lib alternative.

2. If #1 happened then I would look for a good Spirit Filled church that
either baptized in Jesus name or both the titles and in Jesus name.

3. If #1 and #2 were not available and there was a UPC church in the town
that was what most UPCers would consider liberal I would consider
attending.

In a general sense I can think of only two UPC churches I would voluntarily be a member of right now. One is Rex Johnson's in Texas and the other is Rhoni's church. I am sure there are more I just don't know about. Oh, I think I would enjoy renda's new UPC church also. The pastor seems very cool even though he didn't like me at the end of NFCF.