What Would You Do if This Was You?

[Stephanas]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over while expecting different results.

Farming: Doing the same thing over and over while awaiting the harvest.

"And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not." (Galatians 6:9)

It's easy to criticize, but, if the rest of the UPC had accomplished as much as this man in the last ten years, it would be ten times the size that it is now. A church of 30, a mortgage free building, and all while working 50 hours per week. I wouldn't be in any hurry to stand beside this brother on Judgement Day.

"It's not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or when the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions and spends himself in a worth cause; who at the best, knows in the end the triumph of high achievement; and who at the worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory or defeat." Theodore Roosevelt

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by rgcraig

How long should a pastor stay at a church under these circumstances?

He's been pastor for almost a decade.

- Membership is 30.

- There is minimal compensation and he works a secular job fifty hours a week.

- The church building is an embarrassment, but paid for.

- Started the church from nothing.

- He pays some of the church bills out of his own pocket.

- The church members are apathetic.

Renda,
I didn't read the responses prior to posting this. This is my opinion: If the church has not grown in 10 years and the membership is not vested in it - then the Pastor needs to look at why he continues to hang on to the church. The secondary gains he gets for supporting this church could be: 1] His recognition as a Pastor, 2] Pride, or 3] He was self called and not God called.

This Pastor needs to search his heart and find out the true answer between he and God and then make adjustments where necessary.

Blessings, Rhoni

[Stephanas]

Originally Posted by Rhoni

Renda,
I didn't read the responses prior to posting this. This is my opinion: If the church has not grown in 10 years and the membership is not vested in it - then the Pastor needs to look at why he continues to hang on to the church. The secondary gains he gets for supporting this church could be: 1] His recognition as a Pastor, 2] Pride, or 3] He was self called and not God called.

This Pastor needs to search his heart and find out the true answer between he and God and then make adjustments where necessary.

Blessings, Rhoni

This seems like an excellent time for a repost. (It's a lot nicer than what I'd really like to say.)

"It's not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or when the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions and spends himself in a worth cause; who at the best, knows in the end the triumph of high achievement; and who at the worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory or defeat." Theodore Roosevelt

[Falla39]

One plants, another waters, but God gives the increase.
One may sow the seed (Word of God), another waters and
nurtures what has been planted, but God must give the
increase.
Just as he that comes to Christ must first BELIEVE that HE
IS, and that HE is a rewarder of them that DILIGENTLY SEEK
HIM. He repents (his part), and is baptized (the preacher's part)
in the name of Jesus, for the remitting of those sins, and then
God fills (God's part) him with the Holy Ghost. Try as we may, we
cannot do God's part. We are laborers TOGETHER WITH GOD!
And IF the Father has not planted, try as you may, it will still be
rooted up. The WILL of GOD is so important. Wise men and women
still seek Him, with all their hearts.

Blessings,

Falla39

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by Stephanas

This seems like an excellent time for a repost. (It's a lot nicer than what I'd really like to say.)

"It's not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or when the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena; whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions and spends himself in a worth cause; who at the best, knows in the end the triumph of high achievement; and who at the worst if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory or defeat." Theodore Roosevelt

Stephanas,

What I hear you saying is that you disagree with my post. This is your choice. The bottom line which I am not sure anyone can disagree with, the point I was making is: that this is between God and the Pastor.

Blessings, Rhoni

P.S. I stand by my post. There are churches on every corner in the U.S.A. and if you work for 10 years to pay an empty building off that is in need of repair, and the members are not vested in your vision then it is time to sit down and revisit your calling.

[chseeads]

Originally Posted by Bryan

do you need an assistant?

a lot of things ppl have to consider...
dont want to uproot family
job climate
etc

It would be nice to have somebody around willing to help with some things.

[Falla39]

Think of those who by faith endured, believing in He who had promised.
Abraham waited for the son God had promised. Got weary in waiting on
the promise and with Sarah's help, tried to "help" God. But God still kept
His promise.

King Saul became impatient and decided to not wait but go on his own.
Lost the kingdom and his life.

But in the book of Hebrews there is a list of those who by faith won
victories, some didn't live to receive them but had hope of a future
prize. He that shall endure unto the end shall be saved.

To those who will wait upon the Lord, and to those who do not grow
weary in well doing, in due season (God's time) they shall reap, IF they
faint not.

No time, dear friends, to faint. It just could be that over the next hill
we'll be HOME!

Blessings,

Falla39

[Stephanas]

Originally Posted by Rhoni

Stephanas,

What I hear you saying is that you disagree with my post. This is your choice. The bottom line which I am not sure anyone can disagree with, the point I was making is: that this is between God and the Pastor.

Blessings, Rhoni

P.S. I stand by my post. There are churches on every corner in the U.S.A. and if you work for 10 years to pay an empty building off that is in need of repair, and the members are not vested in your vision then it is time to sit down and revisit your calling.

Did you read the first post?

The Church was built from nothing.

Originally Posted by rgcraig

How long should a pastor stay at a church under these circumstances?

He's been pastor for almost a decade.

- Membership is 30.

- There is minimal compensation and he works a secular job fifty hours a week.

- The church building is an embarrassment, but paid for.

- Started the church from nothing.

- He pays some of the church bills out of his own pocket.

- The church members are apathetic.

A worldly model of "success" discounts the Master's right to distribute as little as one talent to His servants. The question is, "Has this brother been faithful to the work that God has given him?" If the record of accomplishment that has been listed isn't "faithfulness." I don't know what is.

The only way to conclude that there are churches on every corner in the USA is to conclude that the doctrine taught in those churches is of no importance. If "Jesus Name" doctrine matters, there are lots of areas where churches are few and far between.

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by Stephanas

Did you read the first post?

The Church was built from nothing.



A worldly model of "success" discounts the Master's right to distribute as little as one talent to His servants. The question is, "Has this brother been faithful to the work that God has given him?" If the record of accomplishment that has been listed isn't "faithfulness." I don't know what is.

The only way to conclude that there are churches on every corner in the USA is to conclude that the doctrine taught in those churches is of no importance. If "Jesus Name" doctrine matters, there are lots of areas where churches are few and far between.

Stephanas,

There is no one discounting faithfulness of the Pastor or Christ's multiplication. I am not sure why you are taking a defensive stance on this issue. Once again, I will say, the calling and direction of the Pastor is between he and God, not anyone on this forum.

It appears this issue is close to your heart. I think your posting is clouded by your perception as it applies to you. I intended no judgement in this matter that I know little to nothing about. An opinion was asked - I gave it.

Blessings, Rhoni

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by rgcraig

How long should a pastor stay at a church under these circumstances?

He's been pastor for almost a decade.

- Membership is 30.

- There is minimal compensation and he works a secular job fifty hours a week.

- The church building is an embarrassment, but paid for.

- Started the church from nothing.

- He pays some of the church bills out of his own pocket.

- The church members are apathetic.

How does one define... "The church members are apathetic"