divine flesh and original sin

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

I thought it was pretty interesting that what the Ethiopian group believes that one is being baptized in Jesus name to put on the "divine flesh of Christ" (by faith) so when a future resurrection happens you have your divine flesh body.

Yeah...I don't think some people have had very much encounters with the DF group. I have had plenty and for them it's not merely an issue of semantics.

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Lets use an analogy. Sailor Bob has a desire for booze....Sailor Bob does not want to get drunk though. Sailor Bobs friends come over with some booze. He feels tempted to get drunk because Sailor Bob has a desire for booze :-)

Okay. So Jesus desired to turn stones to bread and jump off of pinnacles? Just following your analogy in light of my question. Man, this is confusing.

Originally Posted by rrford

Now I want to bang my head against the wall. I saw your post and now it seems you are saying He had no desire to yield (which means, according to you, it could not be called temptation.) Man, you are confusing your own answers here. Above you are maing the very point of what I have been saying. I told you it was all semantica dn hard to discuss such a subject in this venue.


Simple yes or no, please: Did Jesus desire to do the things Satan tempted Him with?

Though the question was posed to Prax, I will answer with a "yes," while remember what "all points" mean.

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Brother Strange

Though the question was posed to Prax, I will answer with a "yes," while remember what "all points" mean.

I keep teling ya'll it is semantics.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by rrford

In all points sure does not mean in every temptation or sin. It means exactly what Satan tempted Him with:

The lust of the flesh;
The lust of the eye;
The pride of life.


But as Prax said, being tempted and feeling temptation are two different things. At least I think that is what he is saying.

Woah...that is NOT what I said..In the case of Satan I said it was Satan TEMPTING Jesus...IN other words Satan was doing something.,

In Hebrews it's NOT the same thing. The author of Hebrews is telling us that Jesus was tempted...now Jesus is EXPERIENCING something. Nor does the author of hebrews say he was speaking about the temptation in the garden.

Two different things.
Satan was tempting
Jesus was tempted

Hebrews does not say "He was tempted by Satan like we"

Rather it says He was tempted in all points like us...LIKE US. We are tempted by our own desires

Jas 1:14 But each one is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desires.
Jas 1:15 Then when desire conceives, it gives birth to sin, and when sin is full grown, it gives birth to death.
Jas 1:16 Do not be led astray, my dear brothers and sisters.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Yeah...I don't think some people have had very much encounters with the DF group. I have had plenty and for them it's not merely an issue of semantics.

I sat down with Brother Teklemarian and took notes. I wanted to make sure that I understood what this doctrine entails.

In Jesus Name

Brother Benincasa

www.OnTimeJournal.com

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Woah...that is NOT what I said..In the case of Satan I said it was Satan TEMPTING Jesus...IN other words Satan was doing something.,

In Hebrews it's NOT the same thing. The author of Hebrews is telling us that Jesus was tempted...now Jesus is EXPERIENCING something. Nor does the author of hebrews say he was speaking about the temptation in the garden.

Two different things.
Satan was tempting
Jesus was tempted

Hebrews does not say "He was tempted by Satan like we"

Rather it says He was tempted in all points like us...LIKE US. We are tempted by our own desires

Jas 1:14 But each one is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desires.
Jas 1:15 Then when desire conceives, it gives birth to sin, and when sin is full grown, it gives birth to death.
Jas 1:16 Do not be led astray, my dear brothers and sisters.

Hey, we are actually coming closer to agreement here.

Good discussion. So then, according to you Jesus could have sinned because he was tempted just like us to sin? Yet He did not sin because He had the fullness of the Spirit which took away the desire to sin. Right?

JK, don't have a coronary.

[SDG]

So is DF heresy akin to Holy Hair heresy?

[rrford]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Woah...that is NOT what I said..In the case of Satan I said it was Satan TEMPTING Jesus...IN other words Satan was doing something.,

In Hebrews it's NOT the same thing. The author of Hebrews is telling us that Jesus was tempted...now Jesus is EXPERIENCING something. Nor does the author of hebrews say he was speaking about the temptation in the garden.
Two different things.
Satan was tempting
Jesus was tempted

Hebrews does not say "He was tempted by Satan like we"

Rather it says He was tempted in all points like us...LIKE US. We are tempted by our own desires

Jas 1:14 But each one is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desires.
Jas 1:15 Then when desire conceives, it gives birth to sin, and when sin is full grown, it gives birth to death.
Jas 1:16 Do not be led astray, my dear brothers and sisters.

Actually, that one might bear discussing at another time. I think most commentarians use the temptation by Satan as the point of reference. Have to look at it again.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by rrford

Okay. So Jesus desired to turn stones to bread and jump off of pinnacles? Just following your analogy in light of my question. Man, this is confusing.

This shows me you just totally did not understand my post. Sigh

Is turning stones to bread a sin? No he was not tempted to turn stones to bread. He was tempted to disobey God by breaking his fast. He was not tempted to jump off a pinnicle as if the law says "thou shalt not jump off thing pinnicle"...he was tempted to TEMPT God.

Second and I have to repeat this I guess...it's NOT the same thing to say "Satan tempted him" and to say "He was tempted"

Satan tempting is what Satan tried to do

Jesus BEING tempted, just like us is defined here
Jas 1:14 But each one is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desires.
Jas 1:15 Then when desire conceives, it gives birth to sin, and when sin is full grown, it gives birth to death.
Jas 1:16 Do not be led astray, my dear brothers and sisters.


Notice HIS OWN desires...not "lured and enticed by Satan"...Lured and enticed by HIS OWN desires...

You got two different things here. Jesus being tempted in all points like us is never said anywhere to have happened ONLY in the garden.

As long as he has a human nature he had the desires of the flesh.

Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

There is a vast difference between saying "Jesus was tempted by satan" in other words Satan was testing Jesus

And saying "Jesus was tempted just like us" which James says occurs because of OUR desires...not because of what Satan did