All Trinitarians are Lost!!!!!!!!!!!

[AreYouReady?]

We as Christians don't do so well in Jesus' statement above.

[FlamingZword]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Interesting is that He did not say "remember to have church on this day", Do you have church on the Sabbath Day?

What are it's delights? I don't see any mention of a Delight in this verse

Isaiah 58:13 "If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:"

As a Sabbath Apostolic I can testify that I call the Sabbath a delight, and Holy of the Lord. and I honor God by keeping the day he rested.

I am not ashamed of the Sabbath for I do find it a delight

[Titus2woman]

I am as confused by Christians who do not appreciate the Sabbath as I am by unbelievers who can not accept the gift of salvation. Why would one turn down a gift from God? The very moment I studied it out I knew it was for me. I had been living in the rat race in a way few people do. It had literally been years since I had done anything that most people would consider recreation. What a joy to know that God has made provision for overachievers like me!

This beautiful day of rest and peace at the end of the week, just when our bodies and minds are nearly spent is better than you can imagine until you try it. For anyone who has never observed the Sabbath I hope you will prayerfully consider incorporating it into your life as something that is both for the good of man and is pleasing to God.

What you will find is refreshing of the spirit, rejuvenating the body, binding the family unit, time for sincere friendships, and a stronger relationship with God as you appreciate Him one more time for knowing your every need before you even ask or think.

As a relatively new Sabbath keeper I am sometimes still forced to work as I don't have everything perfectly in place yet... but I believe that what we have started is blessed by God and will continue to improve our lives as we are faithful.

[AreYouReady?]

Did ya know that there are over 38,000 "denominations" who probably all believe that they are the only ones who have "truth"?

Catholics are as adamantly insistent as die-hard oneness pentecostals and believe that they are the "one, true apostolic church".

While I know that God is Sovereign, expects us to obey and He judges righteously, I also believe that He did not intend on man taking scriptures dissecting it, analyzing it, twisting it to teach others what their own personal conclusions are.

Whatever happened to the simplicity of Jesus Christ?

28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
(Matthew 11:28-30)


For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

(John 3:16)

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

(John 1:1)

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

(John 1:14)


Did Jesus intend on 38,000 different beliefs to spring up from his Gospel?
Christianity has placed heavy burdens on people throughout all these different denomination differences. The burdens are so heavy that people cannot teach and preach Christ effectively.

Arguing and prohibiting things like uncut hair, sleeves to elbows or wrists, permission from pastor for every facet of life, even tithes seem to be quite petty in the big picture's point of view.

Jesus' teaching seems to go by the wayside as more emphasis is placed on how many people are stingy tightwads because they don't want to give up worthless federal reserve notes to the church system. Who cares? Christ's church lived through some of the most bloodiest times in history...all without Federal reserve notes or gold and silver. Take it all away, Christ's church will still thrive until the times of the Gentiles is fulfilled, until Christ is ready to return.

Pastoral teachings even within a church system is not consistent. It can't be if one pastor takes all the tithes and buys himself a smorgasbord of big boy toys and more than one home. Yet another pastor struggles to get the utilities and missions paid. Some pastors have sparks coming out of their eyes when they preach certain "holiness standards". Other pastors take holiness standards with a grain of salt.

Some pastors are loving, kind and generous, others are so hard-hearted that a stake can be driven into their hearts like the old dracula movies, but they would still live while dracula dies.

Blah! It gets so tiresome!

This is why the church as become so ineffective in reaching souls today. Federal reserve notes are the main focus in mega churches with their prosperity doctrines and in smaller churches who cannot make ends meet.

The great commission is to go into the world and preach Christ the Messiah, not for a building to sit on acreage asking people to come to them. Or asking for more and more Federal Reserve Notes to build bigger and bigger churches that 2/3 of the seats are empty.

We were commissioned to go out into the world and witness, preach the Gospel. Not just ministers, because I believe that every person who has received the Holy Ghost becomes a minister of the Gospel of Christ. But...no...man says you must be ordained by man. They are just following the rules of the 501 c 3 rules.

There are so many church organizations who will not fellowship with others that Christianity will implode from within because of infighting. Just think of what could be done for Christ if everybody just lived what they believed, put aside petty differences and unite for the cause of Christ.

Doesn't anybody wonder what God thinks of humanity for all the bickering and fighting we do over the inspired word of God?

We need to get our priorities right with God because very soon all of this is going to come down on our heads. Churches will be taxed and the church will go underground because religious freedom in America is coming to a close.

There will be ordinances made that will prohibit home gatherings all over America at some point in time...soon.

[Titus2woman]

Originally Posted by AreYouReady?

Did ya know that there are over 38,000 "denominations" who probably all believe that they are the only ones who have "truth"?

Catholics are as adamantly insistent as die-hard oneness pentecostals and believe that they are the "one, true apostolic church".

While I know that God is Sovereign, expects us to obey and He judges righteously, I also believe that He did not intend on man taking scriptures dissecting it, analyzing it, twisting it to teach others what their own personal conclusions are.

Whatever happened to the simplicity of Jesus Christ?

28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
(Matthew 11:28-30)


For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

(John 3:16)

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

(John 1:1)

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

(John 1:14)


Did Jesus intend on 38,000 different beliefs to spring up from his Gospel?
Christianity has placed heavy burdens on people throughout all these different denomination differences. The burdens are so heavy that people cannot teach and preach Christ effectively.

Arguing and prohibiting things like uncut hair, sleeves to elbows or wrists, permission from pastor for every facet of life, even tithes seem to be quite petty in the big picture's point of view.

Jesus' teaching seems to go by the wayside as more emphasis is placed on how many people are stingy tightwads because they don't want to give up worthless federal reserve notes to the church system. Who cares? Christ's church lived through some of the most bloodiest times in history...all without Federal reserve notes or gold and silver. Take it all away, Christ's church will still thrive until the times of the Gentiles is fulfilled, until Christ is ready to return.

Pastoral teachings even within a church system is not consistent. It can't be if one pastor takes all the tithes and buys himself a smorgasbord of big boy toys and more than one home. Yet another pastor struggles to get the utilities and missions paid. Some pastors have sparks coming out of their eyes when they preach certain "holiness standards". Other pastors take holiness standards with a grain of salt.

Some pastors are loving, kind and generous, others are so hard-hearted that a stake can be driven into their hearts like the old dracula movies, but they would still live while dracula dies.

Blah! It gets so tiresome!

This is why the church as become so ineffective in reaching souls today. Federal reserve notes are the main focus in mega churches with their prosperity doctrines and in smaller churches who cannot make ends meet.

The great commission is to go into the world and preach Christ the Messiah, not for a building to sit on acreage asking people to come to them. Or asking for more and more Federal Reserve Notes to build bigger and bigger churches that 2/3 of the seats are empty.

We were commissioned to go out into the world and witness, preach the Gospel. Not just ministers, because I believe that every person who has received the Holy Ghost becomes a minister of the Gospel of Christ. But...no...man says you must be ordained by man. They are just following the rules of the 501 c 3 rules.

There are so many church organizations who will not fellowship with others that Christianity will implode from within because of infighting. Just think of what could be done for Christ if everybody just lived what they believed, put aside petty differences and unite for the cause of Christ.

Doesn't anybody wonder what God thinks of humanity for all the bickering and fighting we do over the inspired word of God?

We need to get our priorities right with God because very soon all of this is going to come down on our heads. Churches will be taxed and the church will go underground because religious freedom in America is coming to a close.

There will be ordinances made that will prohibit home gatherings all over America at some point in time...soon.

ARY you are more right than maybe even you realize.

I just spent four hours sitting in the rockers on my front porch catching up with a friend from my old church. We skimmed over all the things that I always have to when I see these people. She had to work through the idea that I left my church, jumped out of the boat, and went to the 'backslider' church (still pretty strict UPCI). Why?... was it standards she wanted to know, looking me up and down, seeing that I still look like Aunt Bea from Mayberry... Maybe it was TV... do I have TV now? ... ummmm, no. Then why? Why would I leave my church family? The ones who loved me, the ones I love. How could I rip their hearts out like that? How could I rip out my own?

Because my pastor told me to. He told me week after week from the pulpit. First he said to read my bible, he told me that if he preached any gospel but the gospel of Jesus that I should find another church... AND THEN HE DID. He preached extra biblical things designed to put a heavy yolk and burden on the church. He lived large completely lacking humility. He openly invited me (and everyone else within hearing distance) to leave if I did not share every conviction of his... he said the words 'MY way or the HIGHWAY' more than once, seeming to delight in the challenge. He was mean on purpose. He loved to tell stories of those who had left before and how they were not missed. He said that his holy ghost was different and better than mine because he was a pastor and I was not, that he was part of the elect, that he knew what was better for me and for my family than my own husband.He was s full of pride. I knew he lied and I left. How do you say that nicely to someone?

But Jesus Christ told me to leave religious righteousness behind, that it was all about God and our love for Him and His love for us. He said that as an extension of that love would come love for one another and humanity in general. He said that some people will not hear it no matter how many times He says it. Jesus said don't sweat the small stuff, it'll all work out. Jesus said his kingdom is coming if we just hang on and to get as many ready as we can.

Instead of following God's plan we spend time trying to make the ones who already know and love Jesus believe every detail just exactly the way we do. We talk about those who only 'got wet' at baptism and we laugh, we should cry if we believe it. People who speak in tongues but don't share our exact doctrine have a 'different' HG, REALLY? We even hint that maybe they are possessed. We call any church with even a tiny difference in standards weak and backslidden. Is there love in any of this?

When popular people are mobbed in our altars, everyone willing to pray with them while sometimes seekers or those less pretty people are often left to pray alone, is this love? Do we major on the minors? Have we forgotten that the proud will be humbled.

It is time we make changes. This is not how we want to be found when the Lord comes back, really it's not. And even though it been said for a while, it is still true, He is coming back soon. Let us be found doing what He asked, you know, that love thing! (Don't laugh)

[Amanah]

AYR and T2W I'm glad you guys are here along with the other female posters.
What you all are expressing is the importance of relationships, the simplicity of what is most important


Mark 12:28-32
28And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, Which is the first commandment of all?

29And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:

30And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.

31And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.



John 13:34-35
34A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.

35By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.



Matthew 5:43-48
43Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

44But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

45That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

46For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?

47And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? 48Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

[Amanah]

I'm going to make a leap here, but bear with me. If Jesus considered the Samaritan a neighbor that should be loved, should we consider trinitarians or oneness people the same?

Luke 10:25-37
25And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?

26He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou?

27And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.

28And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.

29But he, willing to justify himself, said unto Jesus, And who is my neighbour?

30And Jesus answering said, A certain man went down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell among thieves, which stripped him of his raiment, and wounded him, and departed, leaving him half dead.

31And by chance there came down a certain priest that way: and when he saw him, he passed by on the other side.

32And likewise a Levite, when he was at the place, came and looked on him, and passed by on the other side.

33But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came where he was: and when he saw him, he had compassion on him,

34And went to him, and bound up his wounds, pouring in oil and wine, and set him on his own beast, and brought him to an inn, and took care of him.

35And on the morrow when he departed, he took out two pence, and gave them to the host, and said unto him, Take care of him; and whatsoever thou spendest more, when I come again, I will repay thee.

36Which now of these three, thinkest thou, was neighbour unto him that fell among the thieves?

37And he said, He that shewed mercy on him. Then said Jesus unto him, Go, and do thou likewise.

[Amanah]

when I was an UC I was taught that the people who spoke in tongues, who were not Oneness didn't have the real HG, they had a devil.

No, I think they have the same HG that I have.

Do I think I have a greater understanding of truth with Jesus name baptism and the Oneness of God? yes I do, but I also am pretty sure I don't know it all.

My world was so small as an UC, we thought that we were the ultimate church, that people who had standards less then ours were lost. We even thought that according to the parable of the sower, possibly 75% of us were bad ground, and lost. And then there was an elder Sister in the church who taught that Jesus had an inner circle of 3, and we were to strive to be in that inner circle. The wheel within the wheel, the elite of the elite. I thought most of the UPC was to liberal and was lost.

So now maybe my mind is expanding a little too far in the opposite direction, and I'm seeing the possibility that there is hope for many more in heaven then the tiny little circle I once thought possible.

I'm searching for new boundaries, I don't want them as small and exclusive as they used to be, and I don't want them to stretch out beyond where they should be.

Sometimes I think the only way to find the boundaries is to shut myself off from everyone and just pray and read my bible and find the answers one on one. But God moves through his church in a way that I can never experience alone.

Last weekend, I sat in the local UPC church, thinking that being there was likely the closest to truth I was going to be able to get. The woman in front of me had her hair piled up so high that it was truly a work of art, and she had a hair thing like a huge flower sculpture sticking out of the side of her head, her suit was remarkably beautifull. My hair is still not growing right, its fragile from having gone thru chemo and it keeps breaking off, so I'm sitting there wearing a long haired wig just so people won't judge me by my hair. And I'm asking myself, God is this really where I belong? The preacher is telling us to take our wallets and empty them on the altar like the wise men offered all their substance when they came to see baby Jesus. God is this where I really belong?

I know this church is pretty liberal compared to what I came up in, I can see many people there who do not fit the apostolic identity, people at all different stages in their walk with God. Maybe this is where I belong.

My heart is breaking, I don't want to be narrow minded, closed minded, hatefull and exclusive.
My heart is breaking, I don't want to be lost either.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by seekerman

Does anyone know of a trinitarian group which preaches the perverted gospel of denying medical attention to onesself, or your children, in order to please God? You know, the kind of teaching which results in the death of innocent infants, children, women and men who follow the ignorant man who teaches that God isn't pleased, and it might even be a sin, to seek medical attention?

I know of so-called, -self-proclaimed 'apostolics' who preach that very thing. I can take you to the graves of the little children who died under such perverted leadership.

Do we have any 'apostolic' ministers here who have participated and preached in such an perverted religious environment?

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

The Church of the Firstborn which is Trinitarian teaches this all through the Mid-West.

Do you know of any 'apostolic ministers' who have such signs following them and their teachings?

[deafdriscoll]

As a trinitarian I am proud to be lost Mr.Eply.
Question - what if you are wrong for saying I am lost.