Explain these verses against eternal security???

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by NorCal

How can one not preach true repentance?
John preached REPENT!
Jesus preached REPENT!
Peter preached REPENT!

Not, say your "Hail Mary's", Ask for forgiveness and the turn around and slap God in the Face by continuing in Sin.

If you so much as turn and sin once after repentance, it's as bad as turning and sinning 100 times. Do people who believe in what you are saying repent and NEVER sin again???

The same grace that saves and keeps the person who turns and sins 1 time, saves those who turn and sin 10, 100, 200, or 300 more times. We are not Muslims, we are not saved by works. We are saved by being IN Christ.

Now...anyone truly born again biblically, has the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Christ, dwelling within them. Also, the Spirit of God has regenerated their dead human spirit by virtue of their oneness with the Lord. Thereby they are partakers in the divine nature. Any true believer who has a new nature is a new creature. And no new creature can live in continual sin and rebellion against God. The one truly born again will turn from self to God, and will surrender to Christ Jesus, Him living through them.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by pelathais

While I personally think the idea of "once saved, always saved" ignores a number of important points, as you have pointed out; I also feel that to ignore the concept of the Preservation of the Saints as you appear to also have done is equally deficient.

For example, Hebrews 10:26... The manner in which you seem to be wanting to apply this passage smacks of "Christian Perfectionism" through works, a doctrine that I know MichaeltheDisciple heartily supports but for which we find little support for in the Scriptures.

It is a simple fact; those that "work out their own salvation with fear and trembling" and never "depart from the faith" are SECURE in their salvation in Christ. They were "once saved" and they shall always remain saved!

I firmly believe in "working out our faith with fear and trembling." But I think this is often taken out of context. Please note what it is teaching...

Philippians 2:11-13 (King James Version)
11And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
12Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
13For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Notice, we are not the ones working out our salvation. It is "God which worketh in" us to will and to do of "his good pleasure". We are His workmanship in Christ Jesus. God Himself is the one perfecting and sanctifying through the convicting power of the Spirit. It ISN'T our efforts or our works. Therefore, working out our salvation is predicated upon denying self and allow Christ to work in us. Not keeping religious rules and standards.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I firmly believe in "working out our faith with fear and trembling." But I think this is often taken out of context. Please note what it is teaching...

Philippians 2:11-13 (King James Version)
11And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
12Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
13For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Notice, we are not the ones working out our salvation. It is "God which worketh in" us to will and to do of "his good pleasure". We are His workmanship in Christ Jesus. God Himself is the one perfecting and sanctifying through the convicting power of the Spirit. It ISN'T our efforts or our works. Therefore, working out our salvation is predicated upon denying self and allow Christ to work in us. Not keeping religious rules and standards.

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by pelathais

While I personally think the idea of "once saved, always saved" ignores a number of important points, as you have pointed out; I also feel that to ignore the concept of the Preservation of the Saints as you appear to also have done is equally deficient.

For example, Hebrews 10:26... The manner in which you seem to be wanting to apply this passage smacks of "Christian Perfectionism" through works, a doctrine that I know MichaeltheDisciple heartily supports but for which we find little support for in the Scriptures.

It is a simple fact; those that "work out their own salvation with fear and trembling" and never "depart from the faith" are SECURE in their salvation in Christ. They were "once saved" and they shall always remain saved!

Right. While not believing in OSAS, I believe that its difficult to lose your salvation. Basically, if you don't want to lose it, God's not taking it from you. In order to "lose" your salvation it seems one would have to life in open rebellion, unrepentance, and unbelief, endure the chastening of God which is meant to straighten them out, and reject his grace and mercy which would reach out to such a one in that situation. But if one persists in that unbelief and disobedience, I do certainly believe that God is not obligated to remember their righteousness (Ezekiel18:23-32).

HOWEVER, I used to think someone could "lose" their salvation or be "backslid" (which meant the same) by simply trimming their hair, missing church a few week (thus being termed "out" of church), wearing shorts or pants, and a multitude of silly things. I know of folks who in their own mind have been both lost and found (thorugh the falling "out of church" and "praying back through" doctrine) multiple times in a year, to say nothing of a week or even a day. Salvation is not a fickle thing, neither does it rest solely on our shoulders.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Jason Badejo

Right. While not believing in OSAS, I believe that its difficult to lose your salvation. Basically, if you don't want to lose it, God's not taking it from you. In order to "lose" your salvation it seems one would have to life in open rebellion, unrepentance, and unbelief, endure the chastening of God which is meant to straighten them out, and reject his grace and mercy which would reach out to such a one in that situation. But if one persists in that unbelief and disobedience, I do certainly believe that God is not obligated to remember their righteousness (Ezekiel18:23-32).

HOWEVER, I used to think someone could "lose" their salvation or be "backslid" (which meant the same) by simply trimming their hair, missing church a few week (thus being termed "out" of church), wearing shorts or pants, and a multitude of silly things. I know of folks who in their own mind have been both lost and found (thorugh the falling "out of church" and "praying back through" doctrine) multiple times in a year, to say nothing of a week or even a day. Salvation is not a fickle thing, neither does it rest solely on our shoulders.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Jason Badejo

Right. While not believing in OSAS, I believe that its difficult to lose your salvation. Basically, if you don't want to lose it, God's not taking it from you. In order to "lose" your salvation it seems one would have to life in open rebellion, unrepentance, and unbelief, endure the chastening of God which is meant to straighten them out, and reject his grace and mercy which would reach out to such a one in that situation. But if one persists in that unbelief and disobedience, I do certainly believe that God is not obligated to remember their righteousness (Ezekiel18:23-32).

HOWEVER, I used to think someone could "lose" their salvation or be "backslid" (which meant the same) by simply trimming their hair, missing church a few week (thus being termed "out" of church), wearing shorts or pants, and a multitude of silly things. I know of folks who in their own mind have been both lost and found (thorugh the falling "out of church" and "praying back through" doctrine) multiple times in a year, to say nothing of a week or even a day. Salvation is not a fickle thing, neither does it rest solely on our shoulders.

Thank you.
Too many people in our churches are "afraid" they are going to do something or mess up or fail to do something they should do and their salvation will be withdrawn from them and they will be lost.

1 Peter 1:5 says that we are "kept by the power of God." We don't have to keep ourselves saved. The verse goes says we are "kept by the power of God through faith." So, just as we trusted Jesus for salvation initially, we trust Him to keep us saved. It's by faith, not by works, but it's by a faith which works.

[Aquila]

I'm learing that the TRUE “greasy grace” is the one that’s preached as though it can slip right through your fingers if you stumble.