divine flesh and original sin

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Brother Strange

I went back and reviewed several pages. I'm right about what Dan is saying in his usual "charming" manner in equating the ludicrous idea of the half/half doctrine which he sees as not much different than the equally absurd HF doctrine.

But, I disagree that any of us "hard nosed" PAJCers would consign any of them to hell or would we consign the preterist to the regions of outer darkness either. While we can be very confident in the correctness of the absolute neccessity of the Jn 3:5/Acts 2:38 experience there is no comparion to that with the doctrine of Preterism of the HF doctrine either.

JMHO, of course.

That may be, but that's NOT what him and I were talking about, or at least maybe he thought we were talking about somethign else. AT the time I was simply saying what HF advocates believed...I was NOT talking about Epley but the doctrine of Heavenly flesh, thats when DA became argumentative with me saying that I was wrong about what HF advocates believe.

Second I never say Epley claim to believe the sperm was divine in nature, only that it was created by God. There is a big difference there.

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Saying "divine sperm" has meaning. This problem here is in the definition of Divine Flesh or Heavenly Flesh, which is why I tried to point out what they teach or believe and that was where you reduced the discussion to barbs.
Divine Flesh advocates believe the Flesh of Jesus IS Divine in NATURE not merely in origin.

I don't see anyone saying the DNA or sperm or blood that God created was Divine in Nature.

If we want to take the divine sperm/blood doctrine to its logical conclusion wouldn't one have to deduce that Jesus is half man and half God.?

Originally Posted by rrford

Ahhh, but then how do you find any SCRIPTURAL differentiation when it comes to Christ? I personally see none.

(Although we do realize that "the seed of Abraham" is indeed the reference to him being the Father of many nations. Hence, Paul's usage.)

Until Christ, the seed of Abraham was natural. In his seed (Christ) shall all the nations be blessed. Since Christ, the seed of Abraham is spiritual by which those blessings are confered. Christ is both the natural seed (from) Abraham and the Spiritual Seed OF Abraham by whom all nations are blessed. It is the seed of faith, making you and I the children of Abraham by that same spiritual (Christ) seed of Abraham.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

If we want to take the divine sperm/blood doctrine to its logical conclusion wouldn't one have to deduce that Jesus is half man and half God.?

I have yet to see anyone advocate a Divine sperm/blood...

Again simply saying God created a sperm cell does not make the nature of that sperm divine.

In fact it's sort of oxymoronic to say Divine sperm or Divine Flesh

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

I have yet to see anyone advocate a Divine sperm/blood...

Again simply saying God created a sperm cell does not make the nature of that sperm divine.

In fact it's sort of oxymoronic to say Divine sperm or Divine Flesh

Would saying "Heavenly sperm" satiate your thirst for semantics?

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Saying "divine sperm" has meaning. This problem here is in the definition of Divine Flesh or Heavenly Flesh, which is why I tried to point out what they teach or believe and that was where you reduced the discussion to barbs.
Divine Flesh advocates believe the Flesh of Jesus IS Divine in NATURE not merely in origin.

I don't see anyone saying the DNA or sperm or blood that God created was Divine in Nature.

My natural question:

Would not the natural quality of the sperm be deemed as divine if the Holy Ghost just created sperm? Would the Holy Ghost create some sinful and fallen sperm, or sperm tainted with sin? How is that possible. If it were NOT possible, would not the qulity of the sperm then be divine?

Just asking....

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

Would saying Heavenly sperm satiate your thirst for semantics?

If you want to define what YOU mean by heavenly sperm or Divine sperm, go for it. But other wise I can't read your mind. The thread is about Heavenly flesh or Divine FLesh doctrine....I tried to discuss what that doctrine was with you but you became combative over it....so that's where we are at...no definitions.

But you expect me to agree with you that Epley believes in Divine Sperm? Sorry I can't because Divine or Heavenly, in the context of Heavenly Flesh or Divine Flesh doctrine has a meaning. It makes discussions easier when words have meaning

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Brother Strange

My natural question:

Would not the natural quality of the sperm be deemed as divine if the Holy Ghost just created sperm? Would the Holy Ghost create some sinful and fallen sperm, or sperm tainted with sin? How is that possible. If it were NOT possible, would not the qulity of the sperm then be divine?

Just asking....

No....why would it? Again back to the trees...God created the trees. Where they Divine in nature?

DNA is not sinful. Humans are sinful. What we are talking about is just genetic material. Nucleic acids

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

No....why would it? Again back to the trees...God created the trees. Where they Divine in nature?

DNA is not sinful. Humans are sinful. What we are talking about is just genetic material. Nucleic acids

Are you saying that DNA does not carry our sin curse, Praxeas? What then of genetic diseases?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

Are you saying that DNA does not carry our sin curse, Praxeas? What then of genetic diseases?

I don't know where "sin curse" resides....What about genetic diseases?

Joh 9:1 And as Jesus passed by, he saw a man which was blind from his birth.
Joh 9:2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind
Joh 9:3 Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him.
Joh 9:4 I must work the works of him that sent me, while it is day: the night cometh, when no man can work.
Joh 9:5 As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world.

Why Does genetic material...nucleic acids...HAVE to be either Divine or sinful? If man learns to string a length of nucleic acids to form a DNA strand artificially does it become sinful? Or being made artificially, NOT from man is it Divine in nature?

See this goes back to what the first poster proposed...that Adam and Eve were both Divine......yet that was how the serpent deceived Eve "you shall be as gods"