UPC Pastor Convicted of Slander in Pulpit!

[Sam]

Originally Posted by pelathais

...
For too long we've allowed small men with small minds to force their tiny myopic vision of a small god upon us. It's way past time that the Oneness people wised up and demanded better from their "leaders."

AMEN

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by OilCityCajun

Well, I am UPC and called of God but not ordained by any organization. I've already taken my stance, so I see no need for any further comment.

What's your "stand"? I guess I missed it.

You're a pretty smart guy, Oil. Isn't it time that we hucked out the "old guard" and their nonsense along with their made up "doctrines" and "standards" like they were yesterday's fish heads? Time to get back to the Bible?

[Sam]

Originally Posted by pelathais

ah, dude! C'mon! Don't go there. Please don't go there!

just don't try to visualize that

[canam]

Originally Posted by Sam

just don't try to visualize that

This moment brought to you by mistake .

[tv1a]

Does anyone find it peculiar the pastor's attorney is a woman? Based on the pastor's neanderthal views, I would think a female attorney wouldn't be an option.

Originally Posted by DAII

Thanks Mizpeh for bumping this ...

More court testimony from the despotic pastor ....

Quotes from Pastor Fogarty's testimony:

“The Biblical definition of fornication is not what our modern day dictionary says. Adultery is fornication, but not all fornication is adultery… Actually any sexual misconduct or behavior, married or unmarried. That is fornication.”

“Her clothes got tighter. Her hemlines got shorter …she wore improper underclothes,” and Fogarty added that he had his wife, Karen Fogarty, accompany Angela to shop for clothing.

“I am sorry Angela was hurt. But if you’re asking if I’m sorry I said she was a fornicator? No, I’m not. That is what I believe.”

“Maybe I shouldn’t have ever mentioned her name. I should have just said ‘James has the right to remarry' and left it at that.”

From the taped message of July 25, 2006: “If you believe the standard definition of fornication then you do not believe that that person is free to remarry. But if you believe the full definition, which covers things such as perverted sex acts or perverted sexual spirit, the scripture is very clear on this.” “And so fornication covers things such as homosexuality, lesbianism, bestiality, lust, exhibitionism, pornography, child abuse, harlotry, prostitution, solicitation of sex and so forth. It covers all these things. Now I have personal knowledge that I will not go into, that Angela has committed one of these acts…. I’m not going to give you any more information about it. I will tell you that there was some abuse in – in the marriage.”

Fogarty had no comment for the press after the trial. Barbara Marschalk, Fogarty's attorney, is stated to have issued a written response after the verdict, saying that she and her client were disappointed in the outcome and that they were reviewing possible appeal options. “We do not believe that the verdict is supported by the law or the facts, and in particular the law concerning the separation of church and state.” She felt further comment would be inappropriate.

It would appear then, from those reports, that a main basis of defense was that Pastor Fogarty had a right to his interpretation of the Bible and that the courts should not become involved due to the separation of church and state. It was also felt that what happened did not fall into the definition of slander per se and it was questioned whether a claim for slander with no proof of special damages could be sustained. If any of this does not reflect what happened in his defense, I encourage Pastor Fogarty's attorney to contact me so that it may be readily corrected.

(SpiritualAbuse.org)

If her own husband does not think she committed sexual immorality ... why does this man continue to say she has?

How does this man know about her underclothes? Seriously? You sent your wife to go shopping with her?

Surely he has defined a new doctrine for fornication and refuses to budge from it ... why haven't his elders stepped in to correct this?

IS TIGHT AND SHORT CLOTHING .... FORNICATION? ANYONE ON THE GEORGIA DISTRICT BOARD OR EXECUTIVE BOARD CARE TO RESPOND?
If none care to answer I will have to ask each one individually via email .... including the fellowship ... starting with the 188 ministers in Georgia.

This is a doctrinal and ecclesiastical issue.

Why use the word "abuse" when he spoke to the church congregation? Is there abuse, Pastor Fogarty? Surely you should report this.

By recognizing that he shouldn't have mentioned her by name ... and saying that he should have just said that James could remarry ... is exactly what this was all about ... isn't it?

[OilCityCajun]

Originally Posted by pelathais

What's your "stand"? I guess I missed it.

You're a pretty smart guy, Oil. Isn't it time that we hucked out the "old guard" and their nonsense along with their made up "doctrines" and "standards" like they were yesterday's fish heads? Time to get back to the Bible?

In a nutshell, the pastor was wrong. For details, you can go back and read my older posts on this thread. Yes, it is high time that all churches of all denominations get rid of tyrants, self-promoters, and Neo-Pharisees (TM). It is also high time for churches of all denominations to forsake man-made doctrines and extreme, oppressive standards. However, we must be careful to not resort to anarchy in response to tyranny. Standards, when properly presented and created, are intended to stop the flood waters of sin. Lowering or removing the standards is not sin, but it leaves one vulnerable when the tide rises. Standards are traditional values which insulate our personal values, which in turn insulate our core values from spiritual attack.

[DAII]

Originally Posted by OilCityCajun

In a nutshell, the pastor was wrong. For details, you can go back and read my older posts on this thread. Yes, it is high time that all churches of all denominations get rid of tyrants, self-promoters, and Neo-Pharisees (TM). It is also high time for churches of all denominations to forsake man-made doctrines and extreme, oppressive standards. However, we must be careful to not resort to anarchy in response to tyranny. Standards, when properly presented and created, are intended to stop the flood waters of sin. Lowering or removing the standards is not sin, but it leaves one vulnerable when the tide rises. Standards are traditional values which insulate our personal values, which in turn insulate our core values from spiritual attack.

Are you giving Dave Wasmundt royalties for using Neo-Pharisee?

The standards you speak of are very much man-made doctrines. Whose traditional values are you speaking of ... that of Victorian ... Western culture ... certainly not bible culture, correct?

In Bible times, patriarchs like Abraham gave their daughter-in-laws nose rings and gold bracelets as gifts. Traditional enough?

[Sam]

Originally Posted by DAII

...
In Bible times, patriarchs like Abraham gave their daughter-in-laws nose rings and gold bracelets as gifts. Traditional enough?

We don't read in the Bible whether Sarah wore jewelry or not, but, from the gifts that Abraham sent for his future daughter-in-law we can assume that jewelry was customary among the ladies in Abraham's family. Abraham's wife, Sara, is given by the Apostle Peter as an example of a "holiness woman" in 1 Peter 3:1-6. In that passage Peter does not condemn hair styles, jewelry, and clothing but states that the "real" adorning of a "holiness woman" is her attitude and not her outer appearance.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by DAII

Are you giving Dave Wasmundt royalties for using Neo-Pharisee?
...

I would recommend that David Wasmundt book to anyone on the subject of "holiness standards." I have two other books by him but have not read either of them.

[DAII]

BUMP