Is Obedience Better than Sacrifice? Are they the same?

[DividedThigh]

however you decide to interpret sacrifice, that fact is that obedience is better than sacrifice, simple obedience is the ultimate respect to god and his word, every day of our lives, and beyond, nice topic dan, dt

[J-Roc]

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

Phl 2:17 Yea, and if I be offered upon the sacrifice and service of your faith, I joy, and rejoice with you all.


Paul wrote, "Yea, and if I be offered..."

The life of a man of God is a sacrifice offered up for the benefit of the saints.

Many trials we go through are for the express benefit of the saints, who need to see God's principles lived out in flesh. They need to see grace under stress demonstrated.

I enjoyed your notes very much. However, I'd like to offer a different angle to what you said as I interpreted that scripture differently. I don't disagree that men of God offer their life as a sacrifice.

I think this scripture is letting us know that Paul rejoices that he gets to participate in the Saint's offering and sacrifice unto God. I think he is rejoicing at the privilege of being a part of someone's spiritual growth even if it means he loses his life, he is making an offering unto God, but he is also rejoicing over their faithful sacrifice and offering unto God (not just his own). It's like him saying that he rejoices in planting the seed in their heart, and Apollos watered it, but it was God who made it grow. (1 Corinthians 3:6 )


"But I will rejoice even if I lose my life, pouring it out like a liquid offering to God, just like your faithful service is an offering to God. And I want all of you to share that joy."

[J-Roc]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

Once again you have made conclusions for a post that most readers do not see. I think Jeff was clear as to what can happen to self-sacrifice when it is later trumpeted ... it can become self-righteousness.

He made this clear in subsequent posts.

Secondly is self-sacrifice always synonymous with humility? Are they one and the same? Just posing a question to all ... is their a distinction between self-sacrifice and humility?

Thirdly ... one cannot deny that mercy and self-righteousness are linked in various ways.

Evidently, this is what Prax overlooked. This is what happens when the intent, apparently, is to be right more than anything else.

Originally Posted by J-Roc

Dan, one thing to consider also is that a personal sacrifice could be something one wishes to do unto the LORD not because it is an act of obedience as if God expects it, but rather as an offering of praise and worship. However, the man who makes a personal sacrifice (you fill in the blanks as to what that sacrifice may be) then turns to his neighbor and blasts him because he does not make the same sacrifice is clearly acting out from a self-righteous heart...

[J-Roc]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

What He was really teaching was not about self righteousness but MERCY

Prax, I think you are mistaken. The scripture he referred to in Hosea mentions mercy, however his application and meaning of that scripture is explained in the sentence right after that:

"For I have come to call not those who think they are righteous, but those who know they are sinners"

It seems they attained their righteousness by the rituals they kept, and paid no mind to the attitude of the heart.

When men come to the realization that our righteousness comes not on our own merit, but rather the imputed righteousness of Christ...HE ALONE IS RIGHTEOUS...and we are made RIGHTEOUS through HIM and HIS righteousness, then we can begin to truly live in freedom...freedom from man-made fences...

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

Once again you have made conclusions for a post that most readers do not see. I think Jeff was clear as to what can happen to self-sacrifice when it is later trumpeted ... it can become self-righteousness.

He made this clear in subsequent posts.

Secondly is self-sacrifice always synonymous with humility? Are they one and the same? Just posing a question to all ... is their a distinction between self-sacrifice and humility?

Thirdly ... one cannot deny that mercy and self-righteousness are linked in various ways.

Did I do that or did you? You started this thread by quoting me. I think then I have a right to define for myself what self sacrifice is.

Self sacrifice IS synonymous with humility because you are giving up yourself

Mercy and self righteousness are linked?

ANYTHING can become self righteousness, but if a person is truly self sacrificed ie, they have given their will to Him, they can't be self righteous without having reversed direction. I did not see any proof of self sacrifice being what Jesus had in mind

[Praxeas]

just a reminder, this is what I actually said

BTW to me this is a sort of oxymoron...God prefers obedience over our self-denial and sacrifice? Isn't obedience to Him self denial and sacrifice?

Self DENIAL and sacrifice. Clearly when DA quoted me he must not have understood what I meant. So I can define what I meant. Self Denial is denying the self. Jesus did that when He stated "Not MY will but YOURS be done"...Jesus was obedient to the Will of God.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by J-Roc

Prax, I think you are mistaken. The scripture he referred to in Hosea mentions mercy, however his application and meaning of that scripture is explained in the sentence right after that:

"For I have come to call not those who think they are righteous, but those who know they are sinners"

It seems they attained their righteousness by the rituals they kept, and paid no mind to the attitude of the heart.

When men come to the realization that our righteousness comes not on our own merit, but rather the imputed righteousness of Christ...HE ALONE IS RIGHTEOUS...and we are made RIGHTEOUS through HIM and HIS righteousness, then we can begin to truly live in freedom...freedom from man-made fences...

Then it also sounds equally as about those that are HUMBLE, because the HUMBLE know they are sinners and the proud resists God...self denial.