Bott '14

[Sister Alvear]

Let's all go back to calvary and watch HIM die....

[Sweet Pea]

Originally Posted by Sister Alvear

Let's all go back to calvary and watch HIM die....

Thank you, Sister Alvear! ...... Preach Jesus Christ and Him crucified!!!

I realize that there is a need for the ministers and church leaders/workers to be encouraged and ministered to; however, the shock factor and displaying one's own personalities should not be a part of it! Seeing one minister tear down or criticize another minister from the pulpit is NOT encouraging and uplifting! I don't care who your are and how many years you have been ministering. The minister in question is not the first one to have ever used this tactic; however, does that type of ministry fulfill Philippians 4:8? I think not. JMHO

That's just my two cents ..... now you are welcome to give me a nickel's change.

[KeptByTheWord]

It is a good time to be reminded of how Jesus handled ministry. He poured himself out to the people. And yet, even with all his pouring out, he still had to be refilled. How did he do this? Almost every time after Jesus had done great miracles, and healings, and taught at great lengths to the people, he disappeared, by himself, into the desert, or the mountain to pray, and to be alone.

I would like to submit that the reason many of those in the ministry take on the attitude of JA is because they have not found a desert or a mountain to refresh themselves in the Lord. The work of the ministry is very draining, and if it drained the life out of the Son of God, how much more does it drain the life out of human beings?

Finding refreshing will not come in crowds of people either. Jesus never refreshed with others, not even his closest disciples. He was ALONE.

I do believe that those in ministry need time ALONE in prayer, perhaps in solitude somewhere like a mountain cabin... I don't really know... nor do I want to put some sort of definition on what one should do to be alone.... but I do believe that having time ALONE with God, refreshes one's soul like nothing else can, as evidenced by the ministry of Jesus.

At the very least, those in ministry should look to Jesus as their example of how to pour yourself out to the people, and not end up burnt out in the process.

[Jason B]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

David, I didn't post any of the comments for anything other than - there were other people having an opinion as much as you and Sherri, who popped in to comment.

The audience did gasp, so I think they weren't sure who he was talking about.

He did say, "...and I know that came from John Maxwell, because I heard it...but that junk I heard today..."

I don't really care if he says idiot or not. No one posting here could stand up to any type of scrutiny and be found without some flaw that offends someone. Therefore, I am not casting stones at Jeff Arnold.

PO

I'm a bit surprised you're willing to gloss over this.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Jason Badejo

PO

I'm a bit surprised you're willing to gloss over this.

Jason, Don't you think that JA knows what boundaries he can push by now? He is in a group of ministers. If AM needs to take him aside and talk to him, then let AM take care of it. I just do not care.

What I got from the short clip is something I agree with - the idiots coming through the church doors, and some that stay awhile, that don't want to be pastored are not my problem, and it is not my fault if they choose to fail.

They have the same access to God's Spirit that everyone else does - and we access it a lot.

I can't make them read their Bible, pray or make any commitments. Some people are just idiots, like the money changers and the religious Pharisees, or the Pharisees who are now free and a Pharisee in their freedom. LOL!

Good grief. I am reminded of a missionary who jokingly said, after being asked how he liked his country. "I love the country. It's the people I can't stand." LOL!

People can be a huge pain in the tail feathers. Sometimes I want to yell IDIOT too!

And if the preacher quoted Maxwell because he agreed with him, then he is an idiot. If we had called out preachers every time they said something stupid, we'd be in better shape, because they'd be afraid to take such liberty behind - 'touch not thine anointed'. Paul chastised Peter openly because he was WRONG - good for him!

That's all I have to say.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Jason, Don't you think that JA knows what boundaries he can push by now? He is in a group of ministers. If AM needs to take him aside and talk to him, then let AM take care of it. I just do not care.

What I got from the short clip is something I agree with - the idiots coming through the church doors, and some that stay awhile, that don't want to be pastored are not my problem, and it is not my fault if they choose to fail.

They have the same access to God's Spirit that everyone else does - and we access it a lot.

I can't make them read their Bible, pray or make any commitments. Some people are just idiots, like the money changers and the religious Pharisees, or the Pharisees who are now free and a Pharisee in their freedom. LOL!

Good grief. I am reminded of a missionary who jokingly said, after being asked how he liked his country. "I love the country. It's the people I can't stand." LOL!

People can be a huge pain in the tail feathers. Sometimes I want to yell IDIOT too!

And if the preacher quoted Maxwell because he agreed with him, then he is an idiot. If we had called out preachers every time they said something stupid, we'd be in better shape, because they'd be afraid to take such liberty behind - 'touch not thine anointed'. Paul chastised Peter openly because he was WRONG - good for him!

That's all I have to say.

I highly doubt Paul resorted to juvenile and insulting words when speaking to Peter.

I, too, am surprised that you would be supportive of this type of behavior or words from the pulpit and towards another minister.

BOTT is for Pastors, Evangelists, Teachers, Worship leaders, and just about anyone else who calls themselves a church leader.

Again, if quoted right, I don't agree with Maxwell/Gleason...but they're NOT idiots. And Jeffrey Wayne Arnold was out of line and wrong with how he addressed it.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by n david

I highly doubt Paul resorted to juvenile and insulting words when speaking to Peter.

I, too, am surprised that you would be supportive of this type of behavior or words from the pulpit and towards another minister.

BOTT is for Pastors, Evangelists, Teachers, Worship leaders, and just about anyone else who calls themselves a church leader.

Again, if quoted right, I don't agree with Maxwell/Gleason...but they're NOT idiots. And Jeffrey Wayne Arnold was out of line and wrong with how he addressed it.

Listen, David, he has been speaking this way since he began and it isn't the first time he preached at BOTT. If AM doesn't have a problem with him, neither do I.

And, BTW, my husband asked me if DA stood for.....you figure it out.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by n david

Again, if quoted right, I don't agree with Maxwell/Gleason...but they're NOT idiots. And Jeffrey Wayne Arnold was out of line and wrong with how he addressed it.

Another thing, David. If the minister quoted Maxwell as right, he trumped JA on idiocy. Did you think to realize the harm he would heap on pastors, teaching it was all their fault and hard to bear? What a dumb thing to say and teach.

[Abiding Now]

In the late 80s, I was shocked to hear the crudeness JA showed in the pulpit and was surprised that no "elder" ever censured him, but he was lifted up as an example to Pentecost. Now all these years later, the golden boy has embarrassed the very men that should have corrected him. You can almost hear the campmeeting/special service doors slamming. Not rejoicing, but really all in all...sad day for the UPC.

[n david]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Listen, David, he has been speaking this way since he began and it isn't the first time he preached at BOTT. If AM doesn't have a problem with him, neither do I.

And, BTW, my husband asked me if DA stood for.....you figure it out.

I've never heard him publicly attack and insult another minister before. His "speaking this way" was typically using words, not publicly calling out another minister.

Can you not see and understand the difference here?

Funny you keep resorting to attacking DA and yet have not said Arnold was wrong for saying what he did.

I guess now it's acceptable for ministers to publicly call other ministers idiots, fools, jerks, etc.

Sad.