The Truth, in Their own Words

[seekerman]

NOTE: The muslim isn't going to discuss RELIGIOUS Islamic violence in the world today, especially the muslim against muslim violence which is so common in the Islamic religion.

Islam is the most violent religion on the face of the earth today. You'll not find RELIGIOUS killing and maiming and oppression to the level you see it in Islam.

Note the news, when you find killing, maiming and oppression in the name of God, it's almost always Islam. It's a rare exception when it's not.

[Walks_in_islam]

Originally Posted by seekerman

NOTE: The muslim isn't going to discuss RELIGIOUS Islamic violence in the world today, especially the muslim against muslim violence which is so common in the Islamic religion.

Islam is the most violent religion on the face of the earth today. You'll not find RELIGIOUS killing and maiming and oppression to the level you see it in Islam.

Note the news, when you find killing, maiming and oppression in the name of God, it's almost always Islam. It's a rare exception when it's not.

Well "RELIGIOUS Islamic violence" is statistically, in spite of what your TV sez, very rare and violence in Muslim communities on a whole is also statistically very rare.

Coverage of it in the US media is statistically off the charts though LOL so I guess if scaring you is the goal the media has your number. Discussion of it within your ranks is also statistically off the charts and my guess on that would be that if you can be scared into action by a paper tiger it exempts those who scare you from having a real message of invitation that draws you towards something. It is the apostolic way.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Walks_in_islam

Same thing that happens to you or me when we refuse to pay our taxes chum. Property siezed by force and you are thrown out of the community.

Is this what happens in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Egypt, Syria, Lebanon, Sudan, etc?

Oh... and nobody in America gets taxed 'to exercise their christian faith and not convert to Islam'.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Walks_in_islam

Well "RELIGIOUS Islamic violence" is statistically, in spite of what your TV sez, very rare and violence in Muslim communities on a whole is also statistically very rare.

While it may be true that one is more likely to be killed in Detroit or Philly than in Baghdad... I find it incredible how you claim 'violence in Muslim communities on a whole is statistically VERY RARE'.

So who's doing all the car bombings, suicide bombings, pressure cooker bombings (oops, that was probably the CIA, never mind), etc etc over there in the Middle East?

[Walks_in_islam]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Is this what happens in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Egypt, Syria, Lebanon, Sudan, etc?

Oh... and nobody in America gets taxed 'to exercise their christian faith and not convert to Islam'.

(laughing) Christians in Saudi Arabia/UAE/Bahrain don't get taxed for any reason sport.

It's a secret though. Don't tell anyone. They facts like that in difficult places like books and stuff.

[Walks_in_islam]

Originally Posted by Esaias

While it may be true that one is more likely to be killed in Detroit or Philly than in Baghdad... I find it incredible how you claim 'violence in Muslim communities on a whole is statistically VERY RARE'.

So who's doing all the car bombings, suicide bombings, pressure cooker bombings (oops, that was probably the CIA, never mind), etc etc over there in the Middle East?

WELL the US is responsible for about 60,000 give or take bombings over there.

How many total bombings are the evil Muslims responsible for?

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Walks_in_islam

(laughing) Christians in Saudi Arabia/UAE/Bahrain don't get taxed for any reason sport.

It's a secret though. Don't tell anyone. They facts like that in difficult places like books and stuff.

There are more than a million Roman Catholics in Saudi Arabia. Most of them are expatriate Filipinos and Indians who work there, but who do not have the citizenship of Saudi Arabia.[1][2] The percentage of Christians of all denominations among the about 1.2 million Filipinos in Saudi Arabia likely exceeds 90%.[3] There are also Christians from Canada, the United States of America, Italy, South Korea, Ireland, the United Kingdom, India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Indonesia, Malaysia, Thailand, Ethiopia, Nigeria, Kenya, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and as well a number of Christians from sub-Saharan countries who are working in the Saudi Kingdom.[3]
Saudi Arabia allows Christians to enter the country as foreign workers for temporary work, but does not allow them to practice their faith openly. Because of that Christians generally only worship in secret within private homes.[3] Items and articles belonging to religions other than Islam are prohibited.[3] These include Bibles, crucifixes, statues, carvings, items with religious symbols, and others.[3]
The Saudi Arabian Mutaween (Arabic: مطوعين), or Committee for the Propagation of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice (i.e., the religious police) prohibits the practice of any religion other than Islam.[3] Conversion of a Muslim to another religion is considered apostasy,[3] a crime punishable by death if the accused does not recant.[3] The Government does not permit non-Muslim clergy to enter the country for the purpose of conducting religious services.[3]
International Christian Concern (ICC) protested what it reported as the 2001 detention of 11 Christians in Saudi Arabia, for practicing their religion in their homes.[4] In June 2004, ICC reported on what it termed a "pogrom-like" crackdown by Saudi police on Christians after media reports of Koran desecration in Guantanamo Bay.[5]
Christians and other non-Muslims are prohibited from entering the cities of Mecca and Medina, Islam's holiest cities.[3]

(from wikipedia).

Yep, they don't pay jizyah in Saudi, they just get beheaded.

So... suppose America changed it's laws... and levied a tax on all non Christians, saying they had to pay a special tax in order to practice their religion... otherwise they would be expelled, imprisoned, or burnt at the stake.

No problem, right? Just another tax like all the rest, right?

[Walks_in_islam]

Originally Posted by Esaias

There are more than a million Roman Catholics in Saudi Arabia. Most of them are expatriate Filipinos and Indians who work there, but who do not have the citizenship of Saudi Arabia.[1][2] The percentage of Christians of all denominations among the about 1.2 million Filipinos in Saudi Arabia likely exceeds 90%.[3] There are also Christians from Canada, the United States of America, Italy, South Korea, Ireland, the United Kingdom, India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Indonesia, Malaysia, Thailand, Ethiopia, Nigeria, Kenya, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and as well a number of Christians from sub-Saharan countries who are working in the Saudi Kingdom.[3]
Saudi Arabia allows Christians to enter the country as foreign workers for temporary work, but does not allow them to practice their faith openly. Because of that Christians generally only worship in secret within private homes.[3] Items and articles belonging to religions other than Islam are prohibited.[3] These include Bibles, crucifixes, statues, carvings, items with religious symbols, and others.[3]
The Saudi Arabian Mutaween (Arabic: مطوعين), or Committee for the Propagation of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice (i.e., the religious police) prohibits the practice of any religion other than Islam.[3] Conversion of a Muslim to another religion is considered apostasy,[3] a crime punishable by death if the accused does not recant.[3] The Government does not permit non-Muslim clergy to enter the country for the purpose of conducting religious services.[3]
International Christian Concern (ICC) protested what it reported as the 2001 detention of 11 Christians in Saudi Arabia, for practicing their religion in their homes.[4] In June 2004, ICC reported on what it termed a "pogrom-like" crackdown by Saudi police on Christians after media reports of Koran desecration in Guantanamo Bay.[5]
Christians and other non-Muslims are prohibited from entering the cities of Mecca and Medina, Islam's holiest cities.[3]

(from wikipedia).

Yep, they don't pay jizyah in Saudi, they just get beheaded.

So... suppose America changed it's laws... and levied a tax on all non Christians, saying they had to pay a special tax in order to practice their religion... otherwise they would be expelled, imprisoned, or burnt at the stake.

No problem, right? Just another tax like all the rest, right?

So... suppose America changed it's laws... and levied a tax on all non Christians

Had our snuff-sniffing forefathers not specifically prohibited it this is how it would be. America, after all, was founded by people escaping christian rule where non-christians would be executed for small things like believing the world was flat or that the earth was not the center of the universe. Muslims have NOTHING compared to pure christian rule LOL.

There is no jizyah anymore. This is an old law and was abolished long ago.

HOWEVER while you are singing "onward christian soldiers" and rattling chains at Islam could you first remove the beam from your own eyes?

The members of national Church of Denmark pay a church tax, which varies between municipalities, but can be as large as 1.51%. The tax is generally in the vicinity of 1% of the taxable income. The tax doesn't cover the entire budget of the church. An additional 13% is paid by the government. This means even people who are not members of the church finance the church through taxes

There is no official state church in Switzerland. However, all the 26 cantons (states) financially support at least one of the three traditional denominations – Roman Catholic, Old Catholic (in Switzerland Christ Catholic), or Evangelical Reformed – with funds collected through taxation. Each canton has its own regulations regarding the relationship between church and state. In some cantons, the church tax (up to 2.3%) is voluntary but in others an individual who chooses not to contribute to church tax may formally have to leave the church. In some cantons private companies are unable to avoid payment of the church tax

The Roman Catholic Church in Croatia receives significant state financial support and other benefits established in concordats between the Government and the Vatican. By the special agreement between Holy See and Republic Croatia, Croatia is, through state budget, financing salaries and pensions of clergy (even the military chaplains), church sacral objects maintenance and restoration, building and running of church schools and universities, and aside to that still pay a financial tribute to the Vatican. It is also worth mentioning that Catholic Church in Croatia is exempt from most taxes with having benefits to those few taxes it pays. So while specific Church tax doesn't exist all citizens of Croatia pay for Catholic Church in Croatia through their taxes (even members of other religions and non-believers pay for it).

All members of either the Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland and the Finnish Orthodox Church (the two state churches of Finland) pay an income-based church tax of between 1% and 2%, depending on the municipality. On average the tax is about 1.3%. Formerly, to stop paying church tax, one had to formally leave the church by personally going to local register office and waiting during an allowance of time for reflection. This requirement was removed in 2003 and currently a written (but not signed) statement to the church suffices. The majority of resignations since 2005 are now handled through a web site, Eroakirkosta.fi. If one is member of church when year begins, he/she will pay taxes for the whole year; however, these are later returned as a tax refund. In addition to personal taxation, the state divides some of the money collected by taxing private companies to the two state churches. It does not matter if company is owned by church members or non-members. It has been argued that the churches use this money to upkeep cemeteries, to which they are obligated by law.


Taxpayers in Italy are obligated to pay the so-called eight per thousand tax. This tax amounts to 0.8% of the total income tax (IRPEF) and every taxpayer can choose on their tax form the recipient of the contribution. Currently the choices are
The State
Catholic Church
Tavola Valdese
Unione Italiana delle Chiese Avventiste del Settimo Giorno
Assemblee di Dio in Italia
Union of the Jewish Communities in Italy (Unione delle comunità ebraiche italiane)
Lutheran Evangelical Church (Chiesa Evangelica Luterana in Italia)
Evangelical Christian Baptist Union of Italy
Sacred Orthodox Archdiocese of Italy and Exarchate for Southern Europe
Apostolic Church in Italy (Pentecostal)
Italian Buddhist Union
Italian Hindu Union

Since I lived in Saudi for a few years I will comment on what I SAW.

Christian families have bibles. YOu have any idea how many American christians are there? You say they are prohibited there and that is untrue. They hold services on Friday, the same day Muslims attend their mosque. They have a minister. He's a full time salaried employee.

Here is what they spend their spare time doing:

1. Running pork across the border
2. Brewing beer or wine in their garages

You should be unstunned as to why, after flaunting the laws there, they occasionally get in trouble.