witchcraft

[bbyrd009]

Randy, your post speaks to me. I became suicidal at about age 12, and was surely "clinically depressed" for many years after. I attribute it now to naturally focusing on...the natural, the world, that which I am to joyfully overcome. That depression is still beside me, I am able to look at it, say "Hi" if I want, while testifying that it is no longer an intimate.

While your path through this will certainly be different, I invite you to hold an interpretation of "depression" as "that which will not always be present" in a believer's walk, which may sound trite, but the point is to believe that depression will have an end. Amen. Which might not be entirely true for you now? And yet I know you believe in Christ as best you are able, so see the dichotomy there. More triteness, but when I decided, usually first thing in the morning, that nope, I just wasn't going to go there today, and I can get glad in the same shoes I got depressed in, tyvm, that things there changed.

I was offered "depression" just yesterday, actually, after, wow, months and months of not, and had to choose, consciously, "ebb" (as opposed to "flow") as my state of mind then. I now decide what emotion to experience, and no longer experience whatever emotion presents itself to my psyche, resulting in some quite interesting little internal battles sometimes, that I am now free to observe in a disconnected way that was formerly "connected," and I'm not even sure how this changed. You are in my prayers also.

[RandyWayne]

Originally Posted by The Matt

I feel for you, I suffer from depression too, though not as bad. I just have days where it feels like everything's crashing down, everything is about to go wrong. And I do have days when everything's great, nothing could go wrong. Sometimes it seems easier to just blame it on the devil, than to accept that my mind simply works this way. I'm going to say a quick prayer for you right now, and you will be in my prayers tonight.

Thanks. You do know what it feels like then, at least most of the time. For me it has been non-stop BUT as much as it is a pain in the rear I also thank God much of the time. I've made the comparison to Paul's Thorn in the Side on more then one occasion, but that isn't always accurate. It is more accurate to say that it has shaped my personality in ways that I've been able to help others as well as keeping me grounded. I do not know if I would give a rats you-know-what today about God if I had not spent my life with this.

I WILL say that depression and a legalistic church(or "strong standards" church as many will refer to it as) is absolutely toxic. There is nothing worse then being depressed and then being told your salvation is largely works based. The desire to just give up is overwhelming, and in fact did happen for a while. But while I did loose most of my faith in religion it only strengthened my faith in God Himself. I've remained a Christian DESPITE the church, not because of it.

[NotforSale]

Over 10 years ago, my wife and I went to a Native American village to pastor a church there. We learned a lot of things about their culture and history. One thing that really puzzled me back then was they had discovered that many of the Shamans (Witchdoctors) were schizophrenic. They assumed they had some special connection with spiritual realms that the Tribe needed to understand, but in reality, the Shaman was mentally retarded.

This disease also runs on the wife’s side of my family, and I watched her brother become very ill and die. He would talk to himself, play games all by himself, and claim that God was speaking to him. In the past, he may have been accused of being devil possessed, especially when he was seen walking naked through the middle of town, but the facts are, he was mentally incapacitated from this horrible sickness.

With current Science and Medical technology being so advanced, I believe we need to revisit this area of Religious condemnation, where innocent people have been falsely ridiculed and abused. Some have even been executed under this irrational and irresponsible judgment.

[Flutecrafter]

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

And so, a Christian's concept of "witchcraft" can reliably be determined from an episode of Bewitched, then. See that neither you, the collective you, nor anyone you know, has ever witnessed this kind of witchcraft; it is strictly a movie.

your brush is rather broad there, mate.

[The Matt]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

Over 10 years ago, my wife and I went to a Native American village to pastor a church there. We learned a lot of things about their culture and history. One thing that really puzzled me back then was they had discovered that many of the Shamans (Witchdoctors) were schizophrenic. They assumed they had some special connection with spiritual realms that the Tribe needed to understand, but in reality, the Shaman was mentally retarded.

This disease also runs on the wife’s side of my family, and I watched her brother become very ill and die. He would talk to himself, play games all by himself, and claim that God was speaking to him. In the past, he may have been accused of being devil possessed, especially when he was seen walking naked through the middle of town, but the facts are, he was mentally incapacitated from this horrible sickness.

With current Science and Medical technology being so advanced, I believe we need to revisit this area of Religious condemnation, where innocent people have been falsely ridiculed and abused. Some have even been executed under this irrational and irresponsible judgment.

I haven't done much research on the subject, from what I understand, nothing has been technically proven about mental disease...they assume there are chemical imbalances, but haven't been able to SHOW these mental imbalances. It's mostly just theories...from my own experience, you tell the doctor what's wrong with you and they experiment on you with different medicine. Of course if you're oversedated your going to feel as if your mind is better. I'm breaking my own rule by coming too personal on here, but I'm going to share this. In the course of my medical history, I've been diagnosed as obsessive-compulsive, attention deficit disorder, extreme anxiety disorder, and bipolar disorder along with one I won't mention. In the end, I'm being treated for only bipolar disorder, and I really feel like I had a better life before doctors started telling me there's something wrong with my mind. I know this much, I was a lot brighter and had much stronger personal convictions pre treatment. Since I have begun to go back to church, and been prayed on, I feel a lot of symptoms I used to feel slowly dissipating. I can feel my memory starting to come back. I feel stronger, and I ACT stronger.

[bbyrd009]

Originally Posted by Flutecrafter

your brush is rather broad there, mate.

Ah, well I don't mean to imply that it is non-existent, but that this view is probably not the most accurate.

[NotforSale]

Originally Posted by The Matt

I haven't done much research on the subject, from what I understand, nothing has been technically proven about mental disease...they assume there are chemical imbalances, but haven't been able to SHOW these mental imbalances. It's mostly just theories...from my own experience, you tell the doctor what's wrong with you and they experiment on you with different medicine. Of course if you're oversedated your going to feel as if your mind is better. I'm breaking my own rule by coming too personal on here, but I'm going to share this. In the course of my medical history, I've been diagnosed as obsessive-compulsive, attention deficit disorder, extreme anxiety disorder, and bipolar disorder along with one I won't mention. In the end, I'm being treated for only bipolar disorder, and I really feel like I had a better life before doctors started telling me there's something wrong with my mind. I know this much, I was a lot brighter and had much stronger personal convictions pre treatment. Since I have begun to go back to church, and been prayed on, I feel a lot of symptoms I used to feel slowly dissipating. I can feel my memory starting to come back. I feel stronger, and I ACT stronger.

I disagree. There are more studies done today than ever before via technology and historical reference, and being able to scan and observe the brain has open the door to many mysteries of the past. There may not be an exact measurement or test that can be done to diagnose certain mental disorders, but doctors can use many tools (brain scan, family history, head injuries, childhood diet and drug use, birth defects) to conclude a diagnosis.

Schizophrenia is one of those mental disorders that can be monitored and treated. It is also a proven disease of heredity and genetics, and I've seen this in my own family. A man or woman acting Schizophrenic years ago, many would consider this person demon possessed.

Today, this person is sick.

When my brother in law was found walking through town with no clothes on, he had stopped taking his medication.

[The Matt]

Originally Posted by NotforSale

I disagree. There are more studies done today than ever before via technology and historical reference, and being able to scan and observe the brain has open the door to many mysteries of the past. There may not be an exact measurement or test that can be done to diagnose certain mental disorders, but doctors can use many tools (brain scan, family history, head injuries, childhood diet and drug use, birth defects) to conclude a diagnosis.

Schizophrenia is one of those mental disorders that can be monitored and treated. It is also a proven disease of heredity and genetics, and I've seen this in my own family. A man or woman acting Schizophrenic years ago, many would consider this person demon possessed.

Today, this person is sick.

When my brother in law was found walking through town with no clothes on, he had stopped taking his medication.

Could you send me a link to these proofs? I'd love to know more about that. I feel as if the devil could possibly mimic the symptoms of schitzophrenia in a person, really in all mental diseases, to make them feel crazy. He is cunning, the father of all lies. I do not deny that mental diseases exist, but I do feel like we depend way too much on medication, I can easily see a world in 30 years where mental disease is the norm, and everyone takes medication to control their emotions. Please, please, please don't think of me as one of those "medication is the devil" kind of people, I do agree that some people require medication.

[Flutecrafter]

Point of order here:

The vast majority of shaman, wiccans, witches, neo-pagans, satanists, etc..
that I personally know, are well balanced individuals.
They merely follow a different spiritual path than the one that Jesus wants for us.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Flutecrafter

Point of order here:

The vast majority of shaman, wiccans, witches, neo-pagans, satanists, etc..
that I personally know, are well balanced individuals.
They merely follow a different spiritual path than the one that Jesus wants for us.

I don't know, I've known qwacks and nuts who were pagan. However many are "well balanced". I think nutty Christians are the result of unbalanced religion based on the arbitrary will of man. I mean how can one be spiritually balanced when told that God tells their church wedding rings will send one to Hell, yet God allows the church across town to wear them?