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  #21  
Old 06-10-2013, 05:37 PM
Rudy Rudy is offline
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Re: The Reality of God's Reconciliation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luke View Post
I do not speed.

Never go over the speed limit??


Ever get testy with the Mrs?


Watch no carnal movies?


Ever go to the beach?

You don't have to answer.
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If it is God's will for your illness then why are you seeking medical attention to get rid of it?
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  #22  
Old 06-10-2013, 07:30 PM
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Michael The Disciple Michael The Disciple is offline
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Re: The Reality of God's Reconciliation

So stunning. People trying to convince others that they sin. That's where we have fallen. Totally normal for everyone to continue in sin. We should be exhorting one another daily last we be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.

In todays believers sin is like an old familiar friend...always there.
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  #23  
Old 06-10-2013, 08:34 PM
Rudy Rudy is offline
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Re: The Reality of God's Reconciliation

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Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple View Post
So stunning. People trying to convince others that they sin. That's where we have fallen. Totally normal for everyone to continue in sin. We should be exhorting one another daily last we be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.

In todays believers sin is like an old familiar friend...always there.
What's your opinion on this? not trying to be a smartelic.

I John.

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
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If it is God's will for your illness then why are you seeking medical attention to get rid of it?

Last edited by Rudy; 06-10-2013 at 08:45 PM.
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  #24  
Old 06-11-2013, 01:25 AM
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Michael The Disciple Michael The Disciple is offline
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Re: The Reality of God's Reconciliation

Many quote this scripture in opposition to the teaching that a born again believer is able to live without sin:

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
John 1:8

Standing alone and out of context it looks to be true. However lets look at the wider context and we will see a different meaning.

1:5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. John 1:5-8

The problem comes because most do not percieve that verse 8 is referring back to verse 6. John was addressing a specific problem among believers. That some were claiming they were having fellowship (being in touch with God) with God yet they were walking in darkness.

They were commiting some sin yet they thought they were still in fellowship with the Lord. This was the lie. When one is stuck in a sin and refuses to admit it they lie to themselves and become convinced they are still in fellowship with Jesus.

Verse 7 is telling them (or us as it may be) that if we will come back into the light the blood of Jesus will cleanse them from all sin.

Verse 8 then returns to the same point as verse 6.

That being, if one trys to cover their sin and does not admit their true condition they are deceiving themselves and the truth is not in them.

Verse 9 tells how to break the deception and be cleansed of the sin. Instead of saying "I am not in sin" or "I have no sin" we are to confess the sin and be forgiven by Christ.

Verse 10 is further admonition to confess and agree with God that sin has affected the relationship between God and the offender. If confession and repentance does not happen the person is disagreeing with God. In his deception he thinks God is still blessing him and showing him favor. In effect he is calling God a liar.

So please understand. When John says "if we say we have no sin we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us" it was not written to say the average believer could never be without sin.

Obviously this would be a contradiction to other statements by the same apostle in the same book!

For instance:

2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
John 2:1

Here John plainy tells believers to sin not. It would certainly be confusing if the same apostle who tells people to "sin not" would tell the same people that if they said they had no sin they were liars and the truth was not in them as if it could not be done!

He simply adds that IF not even when but IF you sin you can be forgiven by God through Jesus Christ.

Again a few verses later the matter of who it is that is deceived comes again into focus.

2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:3-4

Here John says if we say we know him and do NOT keep his commandments we are a liar and the truth is not in us!

So IN CONTEXT we can see this is EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE message that many are getting out of the apostles writing. Most today think if you say you are not commiting sin YOU are the liar.

Johns real meaning was that those who say they are in fellowship with God and are not keeping his commands (commiting sin) are those who are liars and deceived!

Here are a few more examples from other apostles that if John were telling Christians they were deceived if they thought they were living without sin would be contradictions.

Apostle Paul:

15:34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

He tells the saints to sin not. He says the exact thing John said in 1 John 2:1

Apostle Peter:

2:14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children: 2 Peter 2:14

Peter mentions those who cannot cease from sin in quite a negative light! If he reproves souls who cannot stop sinning he must have believed they COULD STOP SINNING!

So friend it seems all the apostles taught we could walk without sin.
One more example from Johns writings:

2:5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.
1 John 2:5-6

So in conclusion when John says "if we say we have no sin we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us" he is focusing on those WHO ACTUALLY DO have sin in their lives and instead of confessing it are holding on to it.

THEY my friends are the ones who his admonition is meant for. He was not trying to say that obedient saints who were actually keeping the Lords word were deceived for doing what he himself had told them to do.

It was simply showing that we are to confess if indeed we have sinned instead of trying to cover our sins. That would only lead to deception.

Hope this helps! Peace, Mike
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  #25  
Old 06-11-2013, 04:48 PM
Rudy Rudy is offline
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Re: The Reality of God's Reconciliation

Good post.
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Go here on tithing----->

http://www.tithing-russkelly.com/

If it is God's will for your illness then why are you seeking medical attention to get rid of it?
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