Was Jesus born again?

[LUKE2447]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Paul was not speaking of death in the sense that you are saying. He was speaking of that in Romans 7 in the sense that sin slew him. When one is presented with "THOU SHALT NOT", since jumps and slays the person. That is a far cry from the death and life that Romans 6:10-13 and Eph 2:1 are speaking about.

... if that makes you feel better.

[LUKE2447]

Originally Posted by onefaith2

So you agree with St. Augustine that we are indeed sinners by virtue of our birth rather than by commission?

Therefore all infants (or at least those with unsaved parents) that die before able to be baptized is lost or receive the Spirit is lost?

he believes in inherited sin.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by LUKE2447

... if that makes you feel better.

It's what Paul said.

[onefaith2]

Originally Posted by LUKE2447

he believes in inherited sin.

Since we are judged by our works (not our parents or even adam), I don't. As a baby I never worked a sin till I was able to work that sin. Adam's sin to me caused us all to fall into sin because that gave us a SIN nature, not already committed sins.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by onefaith2

So you agree with St. Augustine that we are indeed sinners by virtue of our birth rather than by commission?

Therefore all infants (or at least those with unsaved parents) that die before able to be baptized is lost or receive the Spirit is lost?

I believe all are born sinners, but not that the cross did not handle the sin of infants before they come to understanding. You do not believe Adam made us sinners? What about Christ making us righteous?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by onefaith2

Since we are judged by our works (not our parents or even adam), I don't. As a baby I never worked a sin till I was able to work that sin.

Then you do not believe Adam made us sinners, and therefore cannot believe Christ makes us righteous without works.

[onefaith2]

Originally Posted by mfblume

I believe all are born sinners, but not that the cross did not handle the sin of infants before they come to understanding. You do not believe Adam made us sinners? What about Christ making us righteous?

Christ makes us righteous because we have sinned, not because our very flesh is sinful and that we are born already committing sins. If there is no sin, there is no need for a sacrifice of that sin. Since everyone sins as some point or another, Christ died to make everyone righteous.

[onefaith2]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Then you do not believe Adam made us sinners, and therefore cannot believe Christ makes us righteous without works.

No I don't believe I will be punished for Adam's sin. I believe I would be punished for my sin that I committed by my own free will.

Where did you get that I cannot believe Christ makes us righteous without works? I love how you put words in my mouth when I have said no such thing.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by onefaith2

Great do you speak for God now. Show us scripture where in the likeness of means the same thing?

I speak not for God other than repeating what he inspired Paul to write.

Romans 6:10-11.

Romans 6:8-11 KJV Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: (9) Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him. (10) For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God. (11) Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

couple of translations

Romans 6:5
5For(A) if we have been united with him in(B) a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his.

That resurrection is the resurrection Paul understood as causing him to say WE ARE ALIVE FROM THE DEAD NOW in Ro 6:13. That is not talking about physical resurrection,although I believe we shall physically rise acccording to OTHER passages.

5If we’ve become united with him in a death like his, certainly we will also be united with him when we come back to life as he did

5For, if we have become planted together to the likeness of his death, [so] also we shall be of the rising again;

5 For if we planted together be made to the likeness of his death, also we shall be of the likeness of his rising again;

Everyone I see using a comparison, not an equality.

I see equality. Co-resurrection in our salvation with His physical one/

We sure didn't die like he did when we were baptized, but we are put into his death.

His death counted just as real to God for us.

Same thing with the HOly Ghost, we are put into his resurrection, experience the benefits of his resurrection, but we surely haven't been resurrected the same WAY he was and in the same manner he was. We will be one day.

It is not the same WAY, obviously. But this passage is NOT talking about our future resurrection. Again, read Ro 6:13.

[Scott Hutchinson]

Did not David say he was born in sin and shapened in inquity ?