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11-25-2007, 08:06 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 3,289
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Ministers and Saints leaving the UPC, WHY???
I believe the greatest difficulty and challenge for the UPC is keeping people they have baptized/prayed through, and keeping those seasoned from leaving.
I just spoke to a young man close to the center and he ran down a list of folks who have left this local assembly and I was shocked. The reason for these people leaving is single source, not to different from the reason I unplugged.
Neverthelss, why do people leave the UPC? I bet the reasons have continuity throughout the organization, of course based on the discussions here and personal experience.
I know, we all have been hurt and abused, I am not asking for sob stories, I am asking for principals.
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11-25-2007, 08:51 PM
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Honorary Admin
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sandusky, Ohio
Posts: 6,287
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We're living in age where people are NOT going to tolerate the spiritual abuse from a controlling theology and mindset. Many "apostolics" would rather go someplace where they are treated with respect and loved unconditionally even if it doesn't preach all the truth they are accustomed to know.
It has been statistically proven that people would rather than be unloved. In too many apostolic type churches, people are loved CONDITIONALLY. As long as they "tow" the line, they are loved.
At least that has been my observation. 
__________________
"Those who go after the "Sauls" among us often slay the Davids among us." Gene Edwards
Executive Servant http://www.newlife-church.org
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11-25-2007, 08:59 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ManOfWord
We're living in age where people are NOT going to tolerate the spiritual abuse from a controlling theology and mindset. Many "apostolics" would rather go someplace where they are treated with respect and loved unconditionally even if it doesn't preach all the truth they are accustomed to know.
It has been statistically proven that people would rather than unloved. In too many apostolic type churches, people are loved CONDITIONALLY. As long as they "tow" the line, they are loved.
At least that has been my observation. |
AAAAAmen!!!!!! 
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11-25-2007, 09:04 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: AZ
Posts: 16,746
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It is important to know what causes motion sickness. It often happens on a boat when what the eye sees and what the body feels do not "jive". It causes an in-balance which in some people, can cause severe nausea.
In MANY churches, new members come in and hear what the preacher says, then they read the gospels and quite often the two don't "jive". They read the parables that Jesus taught along with his examples then return to a church where everything is hair/pants/dress length/make up/worldly this and worldy that, with just a tiny bit of "Grace" thrown in every now and again. The very character and Love that Jesus shows is all but ignored.
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11-25-2007, 09:45 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: following the lewis and clark trail
Posts: 2,476
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ManOfWord
We're living in age where people are NOT going to tolerate the spiritual abuse from a controlling theology and mindset. Many "apostolics" would rather go someplace where they are treated with respect and loved unconditionally even if it doesn't preach all the truth they are accustomed to know.
It has been statistically proven that people would rather than unloved. In too many apostolic type churches, people are loved CONDITIONALLY. As long as they "tow" the line, they are loved.
At least that has been my observation. |
I agree! Acceptance is conditional.
Same thing for healing...if you do this and this, than you can be healed.
It limits God!
__________________
"Le sens commun n'est pas si commun."
(Common sense is not so common.)
Voltaire
Common sense is genius dressed in working clothes.
Ralph Waldo Emerson
Common sense and a sense of humor are the same thing, moving at different speeds. A sense of humor is just common sense, dancing.
William James
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11-25-2007, 09:46 PM
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Jesus' Name Pentecostal
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: near Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 17,805
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Well, in the parable in Matthew 13:3-23, Mark 4:2-20, and Luke 8:4-15 Jesus spoke of different results for where the seed/Word was sown. Wayside (beaten path or road) hearers did not receive the Word. Some are compared to stony places where the Word is received with joy but because it has not gone deep enough for strong roots it withers and dies in the heat. Others received the seed but it was choked out by weeds (cares of this world, deceitfulness of riches, and desires for other things). Then there are those that do bear fruit but in varying degrees. It would be expected based on this parable that two out of three would not last.
__________________
Sam also known as Jim Ellis
Apostolic in doctrine
Pentecostal in experience
Charismatic in practice
Non-denominational in affiliation
Inter-denominational in fellowship
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11-25-2007, 09:47 PM
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Jesus' Name Pentecostal
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: near Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 17,805
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ManOfWord
We're living in age where people are NOT going to tolerate the spiritual abuse from a controlling theology and mindset. Many "apostolics" would rather go someplace where they are treated with respect and loved unconditionally even if it doesn't preach all the truth they are accustomed to know.
It has been statistically proven that people would rather than unloved. In too many apostolic type churches, people are loved CONDITIONALLY. As long as they "tow" the line, they are loved.
At least that has been my observation. |
I'll say "amen" to that.
__________________
Sam also known as Jim Ellis
Apostolic in doctrine
Pentecostal in experience
Charismatic in practice
Non-denominational in affiliation
Inter-denominational in fellowship
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11-25-2007, 09:59 PM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ManOfWord
We're living in age where people are NOT going to tolerate the spiritual abuse from a controlling theology and mindset. Many "apostolics" would rather go someplace where they are treated with respect and loved unconditionally even if it doesn't preach all the truth they are accustomed to know.
It has been statistically proven that people would rather than unloved. In too many apostolic type churches, people are loved CONDITIONALLY. As long as they "tow" the line, they are loved.
At least that has been my observation. |
This is so wrong for the UP Church i attend - Thank God!
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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11-25-2007, 10:51 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,781
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I left a church that was becoming spiritually abusive. The abuse was selective. It seemed like a spiritual paranoia had settled into the leadership and they always questioned your motives. Now I attend a very loving and compassion filled church. It's real sad really, many churches are just becoming very "hardness" instead of "holiness".
__________________
"For I know the plans I have for you, declares the LORD, plans for wholeness and not for evil, to give you a future and a hope." Jeremiah 29:11 (English Standard Version)
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11-26-2007, 09:17 AM
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Formerly known as CareyM
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Oregon
Posts: 2,429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carpenter
I believe the greatest difficulty and challenge for the UPC is keeping people they have baptized/prayed through, and keeping those seasoned from leaving.
I just spoke to a young man close to the center and he ran down a list of folks who have left this local assembly and I was shocked. The reason for these people leaving is single source, not to different from the reason I unplugged.
Neverthelss, why do people leave the UPC? I bet the reasons have continuity throughout the organization, of course based on the discussions here and personal experience.
I know, we all have been hurt and abused, I am not asking for sob stories, I am asking for principals.
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I think often times, it has nothing to do with doctrine or even standards. I amen MOW post. There have been times when I just got so tired of the "conditions" in so many UPC churches...we've been to several now, we don't try to hide it. It is nice when you can find a church where the leadership is real and upfront with expectations, love you for who you are as individuals, and respect all.
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