Is There Any Power To Transform In Standards?

[Digging4Truth]

Is There Any Power To Transform In Standards?

If one lives every standard preached...
If the sleeves are down to there...
If the neck is up to there...
If the hair is just so...


If every standard is followed...

Has there been a tranformation of the mind?
Has there been a renewing of the mind?

I just see it as so much more effective and true to the mission to teach people to know and seek the Spirit of Christ.

To seek out what modesty is and live it.
To understand that to live according to God's wisdom returns peace, love, joy and all of these things.

If we seek, learn to love, hunger for & desire to live the very Spirit and nature of our God it would seem that every Godly "standard" would manifest itself because of that search and we will have then truly tranformed the heart.

The parable talks about the sower & the seed. There is no seed sowing in laying out standards. Nothing is planted, watered and allowed to grow.

Laying out standards is akin to just simply coming in and popping full grown plants out of the 5 gallon containers and planting them where there was no plant or a wild one there before.

The time invested in cleaning out the rubble, cultivating the soil and planting a seed is what creates relationship and love for one another. It also gives a true test of the soil.

If you bring in a 5 gallon container and pop the plant out and plant it in the soil then the plant will last for a while because you brought soil from another place with you. But... if the soil is not good enough to sustain life then the plant will eventually die... and we call them a backslider and cut the plant down.

I see no inate ability to transform the heart in the laying out of standards for people to obey.

I see no true measure of the soil (heart) in the laying out of standards for people to obey.

I see no investment of working out the rubble from the soil and help it to become able to sustain life in the laying out of standards for people to obey.

To learn, love, know and follow the Spirit and nature of our God... That accomplishes all of these things.

Short answer is NO! there is no power to transform in the standard keeping...

Rather it is the power that transforms that causes one to be a standard keeper!

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by philjones

Short answer is NO! there is no power to transform in the standard keeping...

Rather it is the power that transforms that causes one to be a standard keeper!

Ahhhhhhhhhhh... I see you have your horse before your cart.

Wouldn't want to do away with a good godly standard... I just think we should try to keep the horse in front of the cart.

[Malvaro]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

Is There Any Power To Transform In Standards?

I've always thought of "standards" as kinda like guard-rails on a road....

they don't improve a person's driving ability, they just keep the driver from swerving off into a dangerous, and perhaps, deadly place.... they are only put in place to protect the driver from whats nearby....

I could willingly choose to smash through a safety guard-rail, but I would end up in a hopeless mess on the bottom of a ravine somewhere.... likewise, I could choose to smash through any "standards" that the scriptures and my pastor have placed in my life, but I would be entering an area that could possibly hurt or destroy me....

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by Malvaro

I've always thought of "standards" as kinda like guard-rails on a road....

they don't improve a person's driving ability, they just keep the driver from swerving off into a dangerous, and perhaps, deadly place.... they are only put in place to protect the driver from whats nearby....

I could willingly choose to smash through a safety guard-rail, but I would end up in a hopeless mess on the bottom of a ravine somewhere.... likewise, I could choose to smash through any "standards" that the scriptures and my pastor have placed for my life, but I would be entering an area that could possibly hurt or destroy me....

I look at them the same way I do all of God's other laws.

If I crawl out on a limb then I am going to hit the ground. It is a law. It is called gravity.

If I live my life after the wisdom of God then... just as gravity is a law... it is a law of God that this will return peace, contentment, strength etc into my life.

If I live my life after my own wisdom (the wisdom of man) then... just as gravity is a law... it is a law of God that this will eventually return to me family problems, marriage problems, pain, turmoil etc.

I live my life, I drive my car, I do all things in this life in recognition of my belief in the law of gravity and how it affects me.

I live my life and do all things in life with the recognition of my belief in the other laws of God and how it affects me.

God is wiser than I and any of His ways I can learn and live will return unto me results reserved for one much wiser than myself.

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by Digging4Truth

Is There Any Power To Transform In Standards?

If one lives every standard preached...
If the sleeves are down to there...
If the neck is up to there...
If the hair is just so...


If every standard is followed...

Has there been a tranformation of the mind?
Has there been a renewing of the mind?

I just see it as so much more effective and true to the mission to teach people to know and seek the Spirit of Christ.

To seek out what modesty is and live it.
To understand that to live according to God's wisdom returns peace, love, joy and all of these things.

If we seek, learn to love, hunger for & desire to live the very Spirit and nature of our God it would seem that every Godly "standard" would manifest itself because of that search and we will have then truly tranformed the heart.

The parable talks about the sower & the seed. There is no seed sowing in laying out standards. Nothing is planted, watered and allowed to grow.

Laying out standards is akin to just simply coming in and popping full grown plants out of the 5 gallon containers and planting them where there was no plant or a wild one there before.

The time invested in cleaning out the rubble, cultivating the soil and planting a seed is what creates relationship and love for one another. It also gives a true test of the soil.

If you bring in a 5 gallon container and pop the plant out and plant it in the soil then the plant will last for a while because you brought soil from another place with you. But... if the soil is not good enough to sustain life then the plant will eventually die... and we call them a backslider and cut the plant down.

I see no inate ability to transform the heart in the laying out of standards for people to obey.

I see no true measure of the soil (heart) in the laying out of standards for people to obey.

I see no investment of working out the rubble from the soil and help it to become able to sustain life in the laying out of standards for people to obey.

To learn, love, know and follow the Spirit and nature of our God... That accomplishes all of these things.

NO the power is in the New Birth!!!!!!!!!!!! We have folks of Weslyan extraction around us to toe the line in every outward standard but are lost.
However our lifestyle does show His work in our lives. Standards like fences are safety barriers that remind us who we belong to. The 'ribbon of blue' on the fringe of the garment were to remind the Jew they were God's people thus different from those they sojourned with. It was blue because they belonged to Heaven not the Earth and they were to be distinct in the earth they lived. Their distinction has kept them a people through every dispersing since Babylon. So standards serve their purpose it reminds me I belong to Heaven and I am NOT of this world. My habits, appearance, entertainment, lifestyle in general tell me YOU are a child of the Most High God a peculiar people.

[Carpenter]

Originally Posted by Malvaro

I've always thought of "standards" as kinda like guard-rails on a road....

they don't improve a person's driving ability, they just keep the driver from swerving off into a dangerous, and perhaps, deadly place.... they are only put in place to protect the driver from whats nearby....

I could willingly choose to smash through a safety guard-rail, but I would end up in a hopeless mess on the bottom of a ravine somewhere.... likewise, I could choose to smash through any "standards" that the scriptures and my pastor have placed in my life, but I would be entering an area that could possibly hurt or destroy me....

Guardrails don't keep drivers from swerving off into a dangerous place, good and attentive driving does! Your car and the guardrails would be in pretty bad shape if that were the case, and not every winding mountain highway even has a guardrail.

The guardrail people have you fooled.

[Malvaro]

Originally Posted by Carpenter

Guardrails don't keep drivers from swerving off into a dangerous place, good and attentive driving does! Your car and the guardrails would be in pretty bad shape if that were the case, and not every winding mountain highway even has a guardrail.

The guardrail people have you fooled.

ummmm, thats the point I was making -- standards do not transform a person's life....

I've seen some who insist on keep banging into the "guard-rail" and wonder why their life went crashing into a fiery disaster.... they insisted on being "free" to go anywhere and do anything they wanted without any potential consequences....

[Carpenter]

Originally Posted by Malvaro

ummmm, thats the point I was making -- standards do not transform a person's life....

I've seen who insist on keep banging into the "guard-rail" and wonder why their life went crashing into a fiery disaster.... they insisted on being "free" to go anywhere and do anything they wanted without any potential consequences....

Well, I took your comments to mean that unless there are guardrails, we have a difficult time driving.

If following outward "standards" could do anything to transform our lives, there would be no need for the Holy Ghost and the Pharisees would have been saved.