Lost Souls/Demons

[Dedicated Mind]

just had a dream. can lost souls haunt the earth as Demons seeking to possess a body in order to escape hell fire? why would a demon from heaven/fallen angel seek to possess a body?

[houston]

Idk, don't think so. Some teach that demons are souls of men that inhabited the earth before the Adam and Eve saga.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Dedicated Mind

just had a dream. can lost souls haunt the earth as Demons seeking to possess a body in order to escape hell fire? why would a demon from heaven/fallen angel seek to possess a body?

You’ve asked some very interesting questions. There are a number of different theories. Let’s look at your questions.

can lost souls haunt the earth as Demons seeking to possess a body in order to escape hell fire?

The standard answer is “no”. Souls either reside in Heaven or Hell after death. However, some believe that the afterlife is more dynamic. The Bible states that it is appointed unto man once to die and then the judgment. But the Bible doesn’t say what happens between now and the judgment in all cases. It is possible that a spirit may linger, but we have no Biblical precedent for the notion. No lost soul will escape the final judgment and Hell (the lake of fire). I believe that it was traditional belief that the spirit of the deceased doesn’t pass entirely into the afterlife until after three days. Clearly the early church believed that it was possible to be visited by the spirit of a dead person:

Acts 12:14-16
King James Version (KJV)
14 And when she knew Peter's voice, she opened not the gate for gladness, but ran in, and told how Peter stood before the gate.
15 And they said unto her, Thou art mad. But she constantly affirmed that it was even so. Then said they, It is his angel.
16 But Peter continued knocking: and when they had opened the door, and saw him, they were astonished.

The phrase “his angel” is an endearing term for the spirit of a deceased saint. Many myths grew out of this that the saved become angels. Saints don’t become angels; they are simply angel-like.

Can the spirit of a lost soul “come back” to haunt on the earth??? Maybe. We see an interesting event in 1 Samuel. Saul beseeches the witch of Endor to call up the spirit of the deceased Samuel. Look closely at what happened:

1 Samuel 28:11-14
King James Version (KJV)
11 Then said the woman, Whom shall I bring up unto thee? And he said, Bring me up Samuel.
12 And when the woman saw Samuel, she cried with a loud voice: and the woman spake to Saul, saying, Why hast thou deceived me? for thou art Saul.
13 And the king said unto her, Be not afraid: for what sawest thou? And the woman said unto Saul, I saw gods ascending out of the earth.14 And he said unto her, What form is he of? And she said, An old man cometh up; and he is covered with a mantle. And Saul perceived that it was Samuel, and he stooped with his face to the ground, and bowed himself.

Notice that the witch “saw gods ascending out of the earth”. The realm of the dead was believed to be beneath the surface of the earth in ancient times. As she called up Samuel… she also saw “gods”. The word here is, “'elohiym”. This word was not only used for the pagan “gods” of peoples surrounding the Israelites, but it was often used for angels, demons, and… ghosts. It is possible that when a witch opens a “doorway” into the realm of the dead to contact a dead person’s spirit that this “doorway” is opened for any spirit seeking escape back into our world. It therefore could be possible that those “ghosts” that are “haunting” an earthly home or location “escaped” from their confinement on account of a witch’s efforts to contact the dead. Consider it a “spiritual jail break”. This would explain why God so strongly forbids such efforts. Also, the text does say that it was indeed Samuel who finally did come forth. So… we know that the spirits of the deceased can be reached and brought forth into our world.

The most “biblical” theory I’ve read is that “ghosts” are actually “familiar spirits”. There is some debate over what a familiar spirit is. It is commonly connected to a medium (or psychic) that consults the dead. Familiar spirits might be spirits of the deceased, but most likely they are demons who assume the identity of the dead to lie to and mislead mankind. If Satan (and by implication his demons) can appear as angels of light… they can appear as one’s departed grandmother. This would mean that “ghosts” are a demonic deception, not the spirits of departed people.

Lastly, there is ONE theory that incorporates the notion that the spirits of beings that were once alive may have become demons. In Genesis we read about how the “sons of God”, or “bene-ha-elohim” (a Hebrew term used for angels in the OT), saw the daughters of men and took them as they pleased. Their children were called “giants”, or “Nephilim”. Here’s the text:

Genesis 6
King James Version (KJV)
6 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,
2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.
3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.
4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

The ancient Jews, as testified by Josephus, believed that fallen angels manifested in physical bodies capable of reproduction and reproduced with mankind. This grave sin produced “giants” (the Nephilim). These half demon/half human offspring are thought to have been alienated from God at birth and absolutely immoral, vile, and violent. Evidently, they were larger than the average human being. The ancients believed that when God sent the flood upon the earth the “sons of God” were bound in chains of darkness for their sin to await the day of judgment (2 Peter 2:4; Jude 1:6). But the demon/human spirits of the Nephilim were neither purely demon or human. Therefore they were not bound as demons, nor did they pass into the afterlife as humans. Instead, the spirits of these abominations were left to roam the earth as “unclean spirits”. Much of this is also written about in the Book of Enoch, which the Ethiopian church regards as sacred to this day. In demonology these spirits are regarded as a lower class of demon today.

I believe the Genesis 6 theory is intriguing. But my vote is that “ghosts” are “familiar spirits” (demons) taking on the personas of the dead. Perhaps “unclean spirits” are the disembodied spirits of the Nephilim. Both are entirely demonic.

why would a demon from heaven/fallen angel seek to possess a body

Good question. Obviously demons desire to destroy mankind and desecrate the image of God, which man bears. This is one motive for possession. However, there is another possible motive. Jesus said something very interesting…

Matthew 12:43-45
King James Version (KJV)
43 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.
44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished.
45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first.

Here Jesus describes what happens when an unclean spirit is cast out of a man. The spirit evidently wonders the earthly plane seeking “rest”. The word in the Greek is, “anapausis”. The Strong’s defines this as follows:

372 // anapausiv // anapausis // an-ap'-ow-sis //

from 373 ; TDNT - 1:350,56; n f

AV - rest 4, rest + 2192 1; 5

1) intermission, cessation of any motion, business or labour
2) rest, recreation

The root of “anapausis” is “anapauo” meaning to “rest, cease from movement, recover, refresh” Now, in context the spirit is seeking “rest, recreation, refreshment” from the “dry places”. The implication is that a spirit wonders the “dry places” seeking “refreshment”… a thirst. Many believe that unclean spirits have a thirst for sin. This is one more reason why sin can be so dangerous in the life of a person. It attracts sin thirsty spirits. But these spirits have a problem… they don’t have bodies to sin with. Therefore, to quench their thirst for sin… they must possess a body. An unclean spirit will seek to alienated a person’s soul (psyche, mind) from the holy. Once this is done the spirit can enter in and take control through “whispering”. As they whisper encouragement to sin and the sinner indulges the spirit’s thirst for sin is satisfied. This is why so many who are bound in sin find their sinful tendency a compulsion even though they hate it. A demon is driving their behaviors. The demon spirit will use and abuse their host as desired. Often plunging them deeper and deeper into gratuitous sin until they either kill the host or the host becomes no longer useful. It’s important to note that thousands of demons can inhabit a single person. Demons also have a “corporate” sense of self while in this mode. The more demons a person has… the stronger hold they have on the person. Also, the harder it can be to remove them. This is the kind that typically needs prayer and fasting for them to be adequately removed.

All of the above are just my thoughts and the theories I’ve heard. Just thought I’d share.

May God keep you and yours,

Psalm 91:4-6
King James Version (KJV)
4 He shall cover thee with his feathers, and under his wings shalt thou trust: his truth shall be thy shield and buckler.
5 Thou shalt not be afraid for the terror by night; nor for the arrow that flieth by day;
6 Nor for the pestilence that walketh in darkness; nor for the destruction that wasteth at noonday.

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Dedicated Mind

just had a dream. can lost souls haunt the earth as Demons seeking to possess a body in order to escape hell fire? why would a demon from heaven/fallen angel seek to possess a body?

There are various theories about demon's origins. The most common is they are fallen angels. Some even believe they fell and became disembodied spirits. The only way they can satisfy their cravings to manifest evil and thereby FEED, so to speak, is to inhabit a body and use it's faculties.

But a demon does crave to enter a body in order to manifest. Whether it is because it once had a body and lost it, is a huge question that is not answered in the bible. So the body issue is a theory. But they do crave to enter bodies and "feed" by ,manifesting their desires.

[bbyrd009]

"Souls either reside in Heaven or Hell after death."

I'd be interested in your doc for this, Aquila;
While it is alluded to, and assumed, I have never actually
read a verse of Scripture to this effect? Ty

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by bbyrd009

"Souls either reside in Heaven or Hell after death."

I'd be interested in your doc for this, Aquila;
While it is alluded to, and assumed, I have never actually
read a verse of Scripture to this effect? Ty

Ummm... you plucked a single statement out of that entire post. And that wasn't even what I was saying. Here it is in it's entirety...

The standard answer is “no”. Souls either reside in Heaven or Hell after death. However, some believe that the afterlife is more dynamic. The Bible states that it is appointed unto man once to die and then the judgment. But the Bible doesn’t say what happens between now and the judgment in all cases. It is possible that a spirit may linger, but we have no Biblical precedent for the notion. No lost soul will escape the final judgment and Hell (the lake of fire). I believe that it was traditional belief that the spirit of the deceased doesn’t pass entirely into the afterlife until after three days.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Dedicated Mind

just had a dream. can lost souls haunt the earth as Demons seeking to possess a body in order to escape hell fire? why would a demon from heaven/fallen angel seek to possess a body?

Hell Fire is a catholic myth. The only "hell fire" is the lake of fire which death and the grave will be cast into

The word translated hell in your KJV is actually hades, the place of the dead or the grave, not a place of torment

[Dedicated Mind]

good thoughts aquila, a lot to ponder. just wondering why demons are free to roam but departed souls are not? since evil demons are chained, god must be controlling the amount of evil in world to some extent.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Hell Fire is a catholic myth. The only "hell fire" is the lake of fire which death and the grave will be cast into

The word translated hell in your KJV is actually hades, the place of the dead or the grave, not a place of torment

Sound doctrine

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Dedicated Mind

good thoughts aquila, a lot to ponder. just wondering why demons are free to roam but departed souls are not? since evil demons are chained, god must be controlling the amount of evil in world to some extent.

Great question. It's like the question I've asked since I was about 14 years old. I've yet to find but one answer to the question. I'd like to know if anyone here can shed any additional light on the topic.

The Bible states that "angels that sinned" are currently bound:

2 Peter 2:4
King James Version (KJV)
4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

Jude 1:6
King James Version (KJV)
6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

Both Peter and Jude wrote these statements in a way that appears to presuppose that their readers would know what they were talking about... because they offer no explanation. Here's my question...

What did "sin" did these angels commit that warrants them being "bound" and "reserved" unto judgment... while Satan himself and the rest of the fallen angels are allowed to roam free???

Any takers?