A Balanced View of the "Birther" Debate

[pelathais]

Ben Shapiro has posted a great essay at Frontpagemag.com. It's short and a very quick read. Ben sums up his argument in the paragraph below (emphasis mine).

"Ironically enough, the biggest problem for America arises if President Obama was born here – because if he was, the problem of un-Americanism is now internal rather than external. Perhaps that is why so many Americans wonder about the birth certificate – they hope against hope that President Obama is a symptom of a foreign ill rather than a domestic one. No matter whether Jerome Corsi comes up with evidence of Obama’s foreign birth, however – it is clear that the problem of Obama-esque un-Americanism is now endemic to American culture herself. We have an ideological problem in our midst, and no amount of digging in Kenya and Indonesia is going to solve a problem that now starts right here."

http://frontpagemag.com/2011/04/22/a...certificate/2/

[pelathais]

Instead of Obama's most devout political opponents seeing him and his ideology as "foreign," they would be much better served to address the problems Obama raises by addressing the very "home-grown" nature of this "un-American" and even "anti-American" agenda.

Once attaining the highest office, Obama as been forced into a series of back-stepping maneuvers as he learns more about leading America. This has actually been good. However, the dogma that is still at his core and most importantly, the dogma held by those he hires and appoints will still be with us for many, many years to come. It is essential that we wake up to this fact and address our real problems - as Ben Shapiro has argued here.

[sandie]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Instead of Obama's most devout political opponents seeing him and his ideology as "foreign," they would be much better served to address the problems Obama raises by addressing the very "home-grown" nature of this "un-American" and even "anti-American" agenda.

Once attaining the highest office, Obama as been forced into a series of back-stepping maneuvers as he learns more about leading America. This has actually been good. However, the dogma that is still at his core and most importantly, the dogma held by those he hires and appoints will still be with us for many, many years to come. It is essential that we wake up to this fact and address our real problems - as Ben Shapiro has argued here.

What are the chances of a wake up?

Americans seem very confused.
70% say we're headed in the wrong direction, Obama's approval ratings with the economy stinks.
Few don't want to raise the debt ceiling, yet they don't want one single entitlement program touched. Rather...tax the wealthy, who couldn't possibly turn this ship around by themselves even if they wanted.

It's very discouraging.

[canam]

Originally Posted by sandie

What are the chances of a wake up?

Americans seem very confused.
70% say we're headed in the wrong direction, Obama's approval ratings with the economy stinks.
Few don't want to raise the debt ceiling, yet they don't want one single entitlement program touched. Rather...tax the wealthy, who couldn't possibly turn this ship around by themselves even if they wanted.

It's very discouraging.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by sandie

What are the chances of a wake up?

Americans seem very confused.
70% say we're headed in the wrong direction, Obama's approval ratings with the economy stinks.
Few don't want to raise the debt ceiling, yet they don't want one single entitlement program touched. Rather...tax the wealthy, who couldn't possibly turn this ship around by themselves even if they wanted.

It's very discouraging.

I think the chances are very good for a "wake up."

First of all, we're pretty much backed into a corner where we have to raise the debt ceiling for now. The Dems have maneuvered us brilliantly and to our "credit," the Republican spending post-9/11 helped immensely to get us here. So, like interest rates, the debt ceiling has to go up or else the U.S. defaults on its debt obligations and we cede the West Coast to China and the North East to the Euro-zone.

I don't agree with the "don't want a single entitlement touched" sentiment. All we really have to do is to slow the growth in spending in these programs, demand that members of the gov't unions fund their own retirements and voilà! - balanced budgets and a growing economy. Much of the projected deficits are a result of projected (and Congressionally mandated!) growth in Federal spending.

Apply the lessons of Reagan's time and we'll start to see light. Unfortunately, we'll also have to plow throw another adjustment period like the early 80's with rising interest rates and slow job growth, but once inflation and energy costs are brought back into line, we'll see a much more optimistic future.

[pelathais]

We have to learn to take our lumps when people or circumstances hit us. When the terrorists hit on 9/11, we tried to roll the effects of that hit off onto the future. It turns out that, as most conservatives had been saying all along, that "future" was really a financial bubble - a series of financial bubbles.

Next time we get hit - either by an outside enemy or by a domestic threat or weakness (financial bubbles and gov't over spending) we just need to take our medicine. Our children and grandchildren will be thankful that we did.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by pelathais

...So, like interest rates, the debt ceiling has to go up or else the U.S. defaults on its debt obligations and we cede the West Coast to China and the North East to the Euro-zone. ...

Would it really be so bad if we gave the west coast to China, some of the southwest to Mexico, and the North East to Europe? That would leave the heartland (minus Chicago) as the new United States.

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Sam

Would it really be so bad if we gave the west coast to China, some of the southwest to Mexico, and the North East to Europe? That would leave the heartland (minus Chicago) as the new United States.

Maybe the Northeast - they at least would be going to a society with similar values to the U.S. - and one that shows the same disregard for their own self interests and self preservation as the NE does anyhow.

Mexico actually needs to be ceded to the "new U.S."

As far as China is concerned - maybe we could work out a deal. The southern half of California in exchange for Taiwan. Both countries (China and the US) would be gaining populations that are already in sympathy to their respective ways of life and the Walmart stores in "new" Amerixico wouldn't have to import goods from all the way across the Pacific.

Given the tight and sudden suppression of the film and television industries in Hollywood and SoCal, the out of work actors would finally have to opportunity to join their "brothers" in the "revolution" by working long hours in the Chi-com controlled sweatshops popping up all over LA turning out piece work to satisfy my materialistic consumerism.

[sandie]

Originally Posted by pelathais

I think the chances are very good for a "wake up."

First of all, we're pretty much backed into a corner where we have to raise the debt ceiling for now. The Dems have maneuvered us brilliantly and to our "credit," the Republican spending post-9/11 helped immensely to get us here. So, like interest rates, the debt ceiling has to go up or else the U.S. defaults on its debt obligations and we cede the West Coast to China and the North East to the Euro-zone.

I don't agree with the "don't want a single entitlement touched" sentiment. All we really have to do is to slow the growth in spending in these programs, demand that members of the gov't unions fund their own retirements and voilà! - balanced budgets and a growing economy. Much of the projected deficits are a result of projected (and Congressionally mandated!) growth in Federal spending.

Apply the lessons of Reagan's time and we'll start to see light. Unfortunately, we'll also have to plow throw another adjustment period like the early 80's with rising interest rates and slow job growth, but once inflation and energy costs are brought back into line, we'll see a much more optimistic future.

I'm glad you're optimistic that there will be a wake up.

And I agree with you, but just how do we get there from here?
Nobody seems to have the stomach to do what's necessary. The least of which is the current administration and the democrat led senate.

[canam]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Maybe the Northeast - they at least would be going to a society with similar values to the U.S. - and one that shows the same disregard for their own self interests and self preservation as the NE does anyhow.

Mexico actually needs to be ceded to the "new U.S."

As far as China is concerned - maybe we could work out a deal. The southern half of California in exchange for Taiwan. Both countries (China and the US) would be gaining populations that are already in sympathy to their respective ways of life and the Walmart stores in "new" Amerixico wouldn't have to import goods from all the way across the Pacific.

Given the tight and sudden suppression of the film and television industries in Hollywood and SoCal, the out of work actors would finally have to opportunity to join their "brothers" in the "revolution" by working long hours in the Chi-com controlled sweatshops popping up all over LA turning out piece work to satisfy my materialistic consumerism.

We could say good bye to anything south of the mason dixon line as far as im concerned,they dont even speak the same language anyway.http://www.wapt.com/r-video/27564463/detail.html