There is a man who used to attend our church for a short time. While he attended, he was faithful in attendance. He was faithful to services, faithful to prayer meetings. He was a good worker, pitched in every time he could that there was some type of work to be done at the church. He offered his physical labor free of charge at every opportunity available to him where he could help out.
He suddenly stopped attending.
I had talked to this man on several occasions, as he is my neighbor. He would never tell me why he stopped coming to church.
Until yesterday.
The problem he encountered was that he felt he wasn't welcomed because of the constant push from the pulpit for giving money. Special blessings prayed upon the tithers. Special blessings prayed upon those who gave to the building fund. Special blessings prayed upon those who gave "sacrificial" offerings. Special blessings prayed upon those who gave freewill offerings.
Whatever happened to praying for those who don't have to give?
This man had no money to give, and he said that he felt he had to pay for his seat in our church. He felt as if he were being beat upon the head to GIVE money. Since he didn't have the money to put in the offering plate, he stopped coming to church. He hasn't attended anywhere at all since that time.
I was just left speechless. I had no response. God help us, because the blood of people like this is going to be required of our hands. When did MONEY become more important to a church than lost souls???
This man has been out of work for quite some time. He picks up odd jobs as he can find them, but he told me yesterday that he'd earned less than $2000 since Christmas. A family cannot survive on that amount.
He has a minor child that he has full custody of. Every dime this man earns goes toward paying his bills.
Not only is he going without many things that we all consider necessary for life, but he is now going without food for his soul-- because of being made to feel like it's necessary to give even when you don't have money to give.
Today, the utility company turned off his electricity. I saw the truck going to his house. Tears started pouring from my eyes.
There was nothing I could do. I would have paid the man's bill, if I had the money, but I don't. I have no idea how much he even owes. I'm not sure how much longer his water will be left on, or if he was able to pay that bill or not. He is a very private person, and doesn't ask for any type of help.
The only thing I can do is to offer to let the man put what groceries he has into an extra refrigerator and freezer that I have in my storage shed to keep him from losing the food.
This man needs a job. He needs to know someone cares. I won't post even his first name, because some of the people who attend my church probably read this forum and I would be reprimanded for bringing this subject to a public forum.
Can some of you take this man upon your hearts and pray for him. God knows who he is, and where he is. He needs a miracle.
Quite a few years ago I got into a financial bind and felt like I could not continue giving 10 percent to the church. Tithing was preached like it was necessary for salvation, failure to tithe was considered disobedience to the Word.
I felt that all I could do was to resign as a Sunday School teacher and stop attending that church so that's what I did.
I am sorry I think that man is making a big mistake and going a little over board.
I am sure that money isn't the only thing the church talks about.
Don't they have an alter call? Where he can get this blessing he thinks he is missing out on?
Sorry, I do not know this man, his situation sounds dire for sure.
But I have been there, been very poor. But I will tell you God is greater and bigger than poverty- unfortunately the way I got out of poverty was by giving.
No one can force anyone to give, perhaps he just feels conviction.
Another casualty of the institutional church. House churches would have never allowed this to happen to this man. Tithing is an unbiblical teaching that places many congregation members in bondage and causes many to leave the church because the pulpit preaches the tithe as salvational. Friends... the tithe was a agrarian tax in ancient Israel. It wasn't practiced among the first century Christians. In fact the doctrine of tithing was revived by the Catholic Church in their quest for more money for clergy and cathedrals.
I believe this man's answer is a warm and loving house church. There friends and neighbors would have taken up an offering to help him specifically without the need to beg church administration to take up such an offering.
Sadly on the other side many churches are in bondage to tithing and the demand for more money. This is because churches have bills.... mortgage, utilities, maintenance, etc. Not to mention the programs of a traditional church. Polls show that 80% of all revenue taken in by churches goes toward salaried positions and the buildings. That leaves 20% to be divided up among various programs, evangelism, and missions. It's a sad state of affairs. House church is the answer.
I am sorry I think that man is making a big mistake and going a little over board.
I am sure that money isn't the only thing the church talks about.
Don't they have an alter call? Where he can get this blessing he thinks he is missing out on?
Sorry, I do not know this man, his situation sounds dire for sure.
But I have been there, been very poor. But I will tell you God is greater and bigger than poverty- unfortunately the way I got out of poverty was by giving.
No one can force anyone to give, perhaps he just feels conviction.
This is probably a bit of an oversimplification. Being in dire financial straits causes unbelievable pressure.
When the bill collectors are calling non-stop, you panic every time the electricity flickers because you're fearful that they've finally disconnected it, the pantries are nearly empty and you don't know how you'll refill them, the auto company has told you they're repossessing in three days if they don't receive a payment, your trash pickup has been halted, you have a tooth that is decaying causing lots of pain but you have no money for a dentist.......
going to church and hearing money, money, money can be completely and totally overpowering.
There's a difference between being poor, and completely sinking financially.
We went through a time just like the one I detailed above, and I still feel the scars many years later. We were giving over and above what was 'required', and we still lost nearly everything. Hearing about money at church was hard, it just was. If you're going through a divorce, hearing teaching about marriage is going to be hard for you. That's just life.
I hope this man is able to recover financially very soon.
There is a man who used to attend our church for a short time. While he attended, he was faithful in attendance. He was faithful to services, faithful to prayer meetings. He was a good worker, pitched in every time he could that there was some type of work to be done at the church. He offered his physical labor free of charge at every opportunity available to him where he could help out.
He suddenly stopped attending.
I had talked to this man on several occasions, as he is my neighbor. He would never tell me why he stopped coming to church.
Until yesterday.
The problem he encountered was that he felt he wasn't welcomed because of the constant push from the pulpit for giving money. Special blessings prayed upon the tithers. Special blessings prayed upon those who gave to the building fund. Special blessings prayed upon those who gave "sacrificial" offerings. Special blessings prayed upon those who gave freewill offerings.
Whatever happened to praying for those who don't have to give?
This man had no money to give, and he said that he felt he had to pay for his seat in our church. He felt as if he were being beat upon the head to GIVE money. Since he didn't have the money to put in the offering plate, he stopped coming to church. He hasn't attended anywhere at all since that time.
I was just left speechless. I had no response. God help us, because the blood of people like this is going to be required of our hands. When did MONEY become more important to a church than lost souls???
This man has been out of work for quite some time. He picks up odd jobs as he can find them, but he told me yesterday that he'd earned less than $2000 since Christmas. A family cannot survive on that amount.
He has a minor child that he has full custody of. Every dime this man earns goes toward paying his bills.
Not only is he going without many things that we all consider necessary for life, but he is now going without food for his soul-- because of being made to feel like it's necessary to give even when you don't have money to give.
Today, the utility company turned off his electricity. I saw the truck going to his house. Tears started pouring from my eyes.
There was nothing I could do. I would have paid the man's bill, if I had the money, but I don't. I have no idea how much he even owes. I'm not sure how much longer his water will be left on, or if he was able to pay that bill or not. He is a very private person, and doesn't ask for any type of help.
The only thing I can do is to offer to let the man put what groceries he has into an extra refrigerator and freezer that I have in my storage shed to keep him from losing the food.
This man needs a job. He needs to know someone cares. I won't post even his first name, because some of the people who attend my church probably read this forum and I would be reprimanded for bringing this subject to a public forum.
Can some of you take this man upon your hearts and pray for him. God knows who he is, and where he is. He needs a miracle.
Ill pray, but his miracle is not a job, but I will pray for that. His miracle is he needs to not feel so self conscious or guilty. Unless the church or pastor our right tells him, you are not welcome here because you are poor, then I can't really blame the church. Did he request prayer for him to find a job?
Does your church ever have prayer for church members that lost their jobs? I find it hard to believe he is the only one
__________________ Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
Every sinner must repent of their sins.
That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
...
There's a difference between being poor, and completely sinking financially.
We went through a time just like the one I detailed above, and I still feel the scars many years later. We were giving over and above what was 'required', and we still lost nearly everything.
...
.
We had lots of financial problems, some caused by poor management on my part. We were taught and believed that if we gave God the first 10 percent plus offerings He would meet all our needs. We wound up filing bankruptcy while tithing.
I have since come to the conclusion that according to Mark 7:9-13 and 1 Timothy 5:8 it is wrong to pay tithes before meeting your family's needs.
__________________
Sam also known as Jim Ellis
Apostolic in doctrine
Pentecostal in experience
Charismatic in practice
Non-denominational in affiliation
Inter-denominational in fellowship
There is a man who used to attend our church for a short time. While he attended, he was faithful in attendance. He was faithful to services, faithful to prayer meetings. He was a good worker, pitched in every time he could that there was some type of work to be done at the church. He offered his physical labor free of charge at every opportunity available to him where he could help out.
He suddenly stopped attending.
I had talked to this man on several occasions, as he is my neighbor. He would never tell me why he stopped coming to church.
Until yesterday.
The problem he encountered was that he felt he wasn't welcomed because of the constant push from the pulpit for giving money. Special blessings prayed upon the tithers. Special blessings prayed upon those who gave to the building fund. Special blessings prayed upon those who gave "sacrificial" offerings. Special blessings prayed upon those who gave freewill offerings.
Whatever happened to praying for those who don't have to give?
This man had no money to give, and he said that he felt he had to pay for his seat in our church. He felt as if he were being beat upon the head to GIVE money. Since he didn't have the money to put in the offering plate, he stopped coming to church. He hasn't attended anywhere at all since that time.
I was just left speechless. I had no response. God help us, because the blood of people like this is going to be required of our hands. When did MONEY become more important to a church than lost souls???
This man has been out of work for quite some time. He picks up odd jobs as he can find them, but he told me yesterday that he'd earned less than $2000 since Christmas. A family cannot survive on that amount.
He has a minor child that he has full custody of. Every dime this man earns goes toward paying his bills.
Not only is he going without many things that we all consider necessary for life, but he is now going without food for his soul-- because of being made to feel like it's necessary to give even when you don't have money to give.
Today, the utility company turned off his electricity. I saw the truck going to his house. Tears started pouring from my eyes.
There was nothing I could do. I would have paid the man's bill, if I had the money, but I don't. I have no idea how much he even owes. I'm not sure how much longer his water will be left on, or if he was able to pay that bill or not. He is a very private person, and doesn't ask for any type of help.
The only thing I can do is to offer to let the man put what groceries he has into an extra refrigerator and freezer that I have in my storage shed to keep him from losing the food.
This man needs a job. He needs to know someone cares. I won't post even his first name, because some of the people who attend my church probably read this forum and I would be reprimanded for bringing this subject to a public forum.
Can some of you take this man upon your hearts and pray for him. God knows who he is, and where he is. He needs a miracle.
Here is a perfect opportunity for the church to demonstrate the love of Christ.
Take up an offering, not just a few dollars, but a couple thousand. Take it to the man, tell him you've heard about his situation and want to help in any way you can. Tell him he's missed very much at church, and yes, it would be wonderful to see him come back, but if he decides not to, your offering is freely given with no strings attached. Tell him your whole church is in prayer interceding for his needs. Tell him you love him.
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