Do You Believe in Predetermination?

[Nahum]

Do you agree with the following statement?

It is almost universally admitted that God determines when, where, and under what circumstances, each individual of our race shall be born, live, and die, whether it shall be male or female, white or black, wise or foolish. God is no less sovereign in the distribution of His favors. He does what He will with His own. To some He gives riches, to others honor, to others health, to others certain talents for music, oratory, art, finance, statesmanship, etc. Others are poor, unknown, born in dishonor, the victims of disease, and live lives of wretchedness. Some are placed in Christian lands where they receive all the benefits of the Gospel; others live and die in the darkness of heathenism. Some are brought through faith unto salvation; others are left to perish in unbelief.

[seguidordejesus]

Yes, except for the last two sentences. I think that the last two sentences are true, but would clarify that God does not say "this one shall be saved, this one, no"....they all have an opportunity (which is why we need missionaries!)

[Pressing-On]

Why aren't you calling it - Predestination?

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by seguidordejesus

Yes, except for the last two sentences. I think that the last two sentences are true, but would clarify that God does not say "this one shall be saved, this one, no"....they all have an opportunity (which is why we need missionaries!)

How so, when its obvious some die without ever hearing the Gospel?

Isn't their eternal destiny sealed by the darkness in which they are born?

[seguidordejesus]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

How so, when its obvious some die without ever hearing the Gospel?

Isn't their eternal destiny sealed by the darkness in which they are born?

It is sealed by the darkness, but not by God. They have the opportunity to come "into his marvelous light". Unfortunately, that chance never comes. These comments of mine are not original, I'm sure.

[seguidordejesus]

Clarification - that chance "sometimes" doesn't come.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

How so, when its obvious some die without ever hearing the Gospel?

Isn't their eternal destiny sealed by the darkness in which they are born?

If someone is seeking after God, not so much Jesus, but God, the maker of heaven and earth, I believe God will go to great lengths to bring his word to that person. Acts 8:26-40

Is there any unrighteousness with God? Romans 9 God forbid!

[Nahum]

Predestination refers to a divine order that something must come to pass. Predetermination refers to the settling of events before they happen, planning a specific outcome.

Predetermination is practiced by man, not a deity. So through the choices of ancestors, a person could be born in total spiritual darkness, with no hope of finding the Truth.

[RevDWW]

Rom 2:11 - 16 (KJV)
11For there is no respect of persons with God.
12For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
13(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
14For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
15Which show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another
16In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

[Nahum]

What do we do with this passage?


30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men in that he hath raised him from the dead. (Acts 17:30-31)