One In The Greek

[Steven Avery]

Originally Posted by Esaias

I have a pdf copy of the full text of the English translation. Go here: https://archive.org/details/M.Servet...y19691531-1532

His writings are somewhat difficult for anyone unfamiliar with pre-20th century literature. Also, he wrote within a theological context dominated by near universal trinitarianism and Scholasticism, so his language must be understood in that light. That said, I disagree with some of his ideas, and others I would word differently. There may even be some internal inconsistencies (eg, in earlier parts he speaks of the divine Persons (plural) but in later parts he affirms there is only ONE Person of God).

But overall I have found his book to be the most thought provoking and over all accurate depiction of Scriptural Christology presented in "theological terms". A good second runner up (possibly more accessible to the reader) is James Dunn's Christology in the Making but that is actually a Biblical theology not a Systematic theology, so it's more of a ground laying treatise than a summary presentation.

Originally Posted by Costeon

Thank you very much for posting the link to Servetus's book!

Yes, I think that is the only full book online (one PDF text is mangled by sacred namers inserting faux names.)

Here is an HTML version of the Servetus part by some Unitarians

Errors of the Trinity
http://godglorified.com/errors_of_the_trinity.htm

Some of the pages, same text, are also online here:

The Two Treatises of Servetus on the Trinity: On the Errors of the Trinity, Seven Books, MDXXXI, Dialogues on the Trinity, Two Books, On the Righteousness of Christ's Kingdom, Four Chapters, MDXXXII
Wipf and Stock (2013)
https://books.google.com/books?id=WtFNAwAAQBAJ

There is a bit of analysis here:

Servetus, Swedenborg and the Nature of God (2005)
by Andrew Malcolm Thomas Dibb
https://books.google.com/books?id=_wdOqoatAJcC&pg=PA67

Here are some islamists trying to puzzle it out:
https://www.bismikaallahuma.org/chri...f-the-trinity/

The Servetus crew does not seem to know of the Archive.org book.
https://miguelservet.org/servetus/red_books.htm

Some history in a John Calvin bio.
https://books.google.com/books?id=NTwDAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA251

7-page AFF thread in 2008-2015:

On The Errors of the Trinity by Michael Servetus
http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...ad.php?t=14098

John Calvin vs. Michael Servetus - 2009
http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...ad.php?t=26095

One in the Greek - 2019, this thread
http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...d.php?p=157049

Here is an interesting Latin page in another book:

Christianismi restitutio. Totius ecclesiae apostolicae est ad sua limina ...
by Michael Servetus
https://books.google.com/books?id=72tWAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA25

There is an English translation in 2007

The restoration of Christianity: an English translation of Christianismi restitutio, 1553 - Christopher A. Hoffman, Marian Hillar

It is only available in sketchy mode, so it would have to be found in a library.

2008 blog discussion, Apostolic

Michael Servetus: Heretic or Hero?
https://oldlandmark.wordpress.com/20...retic-or-hero/

In addition to the Wilbur translation of Errors, he uses

Bainton, Roland H., trans. Concerning Heretics, an anonymous work attributed to Sebastian Castellio. New York: Octagon Books, Inc., 1965.

Walker, Williston. John Calvin: the Organiser of Reformed Protestantism 1509-1564. New York: Shocken Books, 1906.

Wilbur, Earl Morse. A History of Unitarianism Socianism and its Antecedents. Cambridge, Mass.: Harvard University Press, 1947.

=====================

Heavenly Witnesses in two spots in Errors
https://archive.org/details/M.Servet...-1532/page/n35

Starting at the bottom of p. 35, later maybe p. 40

=====================

Drummond bio.

The life of Michael Servetus: the Spanish physician, who, for the alleged crime of heresy, was entrapped, imprisoned, and burned by John Calvin the reformer, in the city of Geneva, October 27, 1553 (1848)
William Hamilton Drummond
https://books.google.com/books?id=CyQEAAAAQAAJ

[rdp]

*Do yourselves a favor and watch this brief clip of Trinitarian academics making fun and laughing about Servetus’s murder. Make 100% certain that you watch until the clip ends (it’s not at all long) to see them laughing at a recent conference (e.g., Piper, et al.). Prepare to be infuriated.

*Clip: https://apostolicacademics.com/2015/...-of-calvinism/

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by rdp

*Do yourselves a favor and watch this brief clip of Trinitarian academics making fun and laughing about Servetus’s murder. Make 100% certain that you watch until the clip ends (it’s not at all long) to see them laughing at a recent conference (e.g., Piper, et al.). Prepare to be infuriated.

*Clip: https://apostolicacademics.com/2015/...-of-calvinism/

What's infuriating is the dishonesty and attempting to sugar coat things. At least many catholics are honest about history and unapologetic for their belief in papal temporal authority. In that, they are far better than the average run of the milquetoast Protestant.

[Scott Pitta]

Bloodshed in the name of God is not a laughing matter.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Help needed.

Can someone tell me if there is any difference in Greek between these words "one" in Greek from our English Bibles?

Mark 12:29

29And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:

1 Tim. 2:5

5For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

John 10:30

I and my Father are one.

1 John 5:7-8

7For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 8And there are three that bear witness in earth, the spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

Appreciate the help!

There are 3 genders,
Masculine is Heis
Feminine is MIA
Neuter is Hen.

Hen is most often the word when a unity is the idea
Heis is most often the word when a numerical One is the idea.
Mia? I haven't really looked into it much.

Heis is used in the Shema. Hen is used in John 10:30

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

There are 3 genders,
Masculine is Heis
Feminine is MIA
Neuter is Hen.

Hen is most often the word when a unity is the idea
Heis is most often the word when a numerical One is the idea.
Mia? I haven't really looked into it much.

Heis is used in the Shema. Hen is used in John 10:30

So heis is used in both cases in 1 Tim. 2:5?

[Costeon]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

So heis is used in both cases in 1 Tim. 2:5?

Yes.

Please see post 3 in this thread.

[Scott Pitta]

Translators translate both hen and heis as "one". Are there examples of these theological ideas translated differently in English ??

I do not see a difference between eis and hen. They are different forms of the same word.

[Costeon]

Originally Posted by Scott Pitta

I do not see a difference between eis and hen. They are different forms of the same word.

Yes, but the writers of the NT used hen in some circumstances and heis in others. The latter seems easy: heis is used with a singular masculine noun. The former is easy in some circumstance: with a singular neuter noun. The question is, Why did writers choose to use the neuter hen in some contexts involving a compound subject, as in John 10:30?

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Costeon

Yes, but the writers of the NT used hen in some circumstances and heis in others. The latter seems easy: heis is used with a singular masculine noun. The former is easy in some circumstance: with a singular neuter noun. The question is, Why did writers choose to use the neuter hen in some contexts involving a compound subject, as in John 10:30?

Before theological reasons can be assigned to the different usages of "one" the grammar has to be worked out thoroughly. In other words, I'm pretty sure the reason for heis, mia, hen usages is grammatical and regulated by ordinary Greek language rules, and has little or nothing to do with metaphysics.