Do You Believe in Women Pastors?

[notofworks]

Hey Brat-lady, I just noticed that OPII and I are both going after you!Me and OPII, we're a team!! Come on, OPII, let's get her!!

[OldPathsII]

Originally Posted by notofworks

Hey Brat-lady, I just noticed that OPII and I are both going after you!Me and OPII, we're a team!! Come on, OPII, let's get her!!

God help us. If you're agreeing with me, I'll change my mind.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by notofworks

You culturalized "Let a woman keep silent in the church" by saying you think it's ok for a woman to preach. The only way you could arrive at that opinion is to say that "Let a woman keep silent in the church" was cultural. No?

I think it was only partially cultural. How's that for contradiction? Paul drew a line to the heart of the problem when he said that he didn't suffer a woman to teach, or "usurp authority over the man." His response to the problem was pretty chauvinistic--basically, "sit down and shut up." Considering the fact that most women WERE uneducated, they may have been asking some pretty ignorant questions, and disrupting service for things that they would have been better off discussing at home with their presumably more educated husbands. Additionally, he goes on to comment about Eve's deception, lending credence to the idea that he was even suspicious of a woman's ability to discern between right and wrong. Maybe he thought women were more susceptible to false doctrine. I'm just surmising about Paul's thoughts, mind you--I didn't say those were MY opinions.

So I'm confused here....do you think a woman can be in a position of authority or not? Either they can or they can't and if they can, how do you eliminate, scripturally, the authoritative position of pastor?

I'm not sure. I see a difference between permitted authority or positions that have been appointed and taking authority of my own accord. I also see a difference between God-given authority to share the Gospel and administrative roles. If you want to present a case for one side or the other, I'll read it with an open mind. I'm not sure why you feel the need to press me into choosing one stance or another. It's been a difficult subject for many, many Christians for centuries, so how could I have it all figured out, especially in the space of a single thread?

You've assumed a position of authority here on this forum, haven't you? Maybe you should resign!

Oh, would that make you happy?

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

I think it was only partially cultural. How's that for contradiction? Paul drew a line to the heart of the problem when he said that he didn't suffer a woman to teach, or "usurp authority over the man." His response to the problem was pretty chauvinistic--basically, "sit down and shut up." Considering the fact that most women WERE uneducated, they may have been asking some pretty ignorant questions, and disrupting service for things that they would have been better off discussing at home with their presumably more educated husbands. Additionally, he goes on to comment about Eve's deception, lending credence to the idea that he was even suspicious of a woman's ability to discern between right and wrong. Maybe he thought women were more susceptible to false doctrine. I'm just surmising about Paul's thoughts, mind you--I didn't say those were MY opinions.



I'm not sure. I see a difference between permitted authority or positions that have been appointed and taking authority of my own accord. I also see a difference between God-given authority to share the Gospel and administrative roles. If you want to present a case for one side or the other, I'll read it with an open mind. I'm not sure why you feel the need to press me into choosing one stance or another. It's been a difficult subject for many, many Christians for centuries, so how could I have it all figured out, especially in the space of a single thread?



Oh, would that make you happy?

So when Paul said he suffered not a woman to teach, do you believe that it's acceptable for a woman to get up and teach, and if so, how do you get around that? And if you get around that, how do you then prohibit women from pastoring? Or, is it just a matter of taste? If it's just your preference, I get that. My wife would be right there with you. I could be pastored by a woman, myself but I'll admit, only certain personalities.

The second in command at our church is a lady. She also speaks occasionally, but essentially, she's in charge of all the day-to-day operations of the church. Personally, I have difficulties with bossy ladies (like yourself) but she's not that at all and is very strong, yet easy to work with. I have no issue with it.

No, you don't have to quit your Admin job. I'm sure the pay is good and your family may need the second income.

[houston]

really NOW?? :-/

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by notofworks

So when Paul said he suffered not a woman to teach, do you believe that it's acceptable for a woman to get up and teach, and if so, how do you get around that? And if you get around that, how do you then prohibit women from pastoring? Or, is it just a matter of taste? If it's just your preference, I get that. My wife would be right there with you. I could be pastored by a woman, myself but I'll admit, only certain personalities.

The second in command at our church is a lady. She also speaks occasionally, but essentially, she's in charge of all the day-to-day operations of the church. Personally, I have difficulties with bossy ladies (like yourself) but she's not that at all and is very strong, yet easy to work with. I have no issue with it.

Disagreeable and bossy aren't quite the same thing.

And yes, it's also partially a preference. I find men easier to deal with. They're straightforward, linear thinkers, and just, well, simpler. I don't mean that in a bad way. Additionally, I had a very negative experience with a particular pastor's wife, and even though I AM a woman, I can't help but feel a little distrust toward women in leadership. It isn't a logical or rational feeling, but it still creeps up from time to time. And I'm a church music director and teacher, among other things. LOL!!! It's all very contradictory.

My pastor's wife speaks every Mother's Day and always does a fantastic job. I'd have a hard time sitting through it if she was the type to scream and yell and get red in the face and slap her hand down on the podium every time she made a point. Well, come to think of it, I don't really enjoy men who do that either--but I can tolerate it because I associate aggression with masculinity.

Now have fun analyzing all THAT mess.

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Disagreeable and bossy aren't quite the same thing.

And yes, it's also partially a preference. I find men easier to deal with. They're straightforward, linear thinkers, and just, well, simpler. I don't mean that in a bad way. Additionally, I had a very negative experience with a particular pastor's wife, and even though I AM a woman, I can't help but feel a little distrust toward women in leadership. It isn't a logical or rational feeling, but it still creeps up from time to time. And I'm a church music director and teacher, among other things. LOL!!! It's all very contradictory.

My pastor's wife speaks every Mother's Day and always does a fantastic job. I'd have a hard time sitting through it if she was the type to scream and yell and get red in the face and slap her hand down on the podium every time she made a point. Well, come to think of it, I don't really enjoy men who do that either--but I can tolerate it because I associate aggression with masculinity.

Now have fun analyzing all THAT mess.

I have a difficult time with pastor's wives that try to do the pastoring for their husbands. When her influence is the overwhelming theme of everything, it's usually not a good situation. You with me there?

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by houston

really NOW?? :-/

Really what?

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by notofworks

I have a difficult time with pastor's wives that try to do the pastoring for their husbands. When her influence is the overwhelming theme of everything, it's usually not a good situation. You with me there?

With you. You nailed it.

[notofworks]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

With you. You nailed it.

I guess the bottom line is, I've struggled more with domineering pastor's wives than women pastors, and for that matter, anyone who attempted to exert undue influence on the pastor. I know there's a problem with out-of-control-dictator-type pastors, but the opposite of the pendulum is just as true, and that is, pastors who are dominated by others and never allowed to properly fill their office as God intended.