The UPC is a dying movement!

[StillStanding]

I am saddened by the decline of the UPCI because it's DNA flows through my veins. I still consider them "family".

IMO, they bent to the demands of the old guard for too long and are now paying the price. I honestly hope they find a way to turn things around.

[freeatlast]

Wow 9 pages...is it dead yet? I had heard it was on life support.

They should call in Stoneking and Ruth R. wave some uncut hair around....that'll bring it back from the dead ;-)

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

It's a sad day when Ultra Cons and Liberals have something in common in attacking the UPC

"The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated."
Mark Twain and NOW the United Pentecostal Church International.

Prax my dear friend, It seems to me, there are a few who are chafing at the bit to see a group go down to justify there own silliness. Still sounds like a lot of sour grapes to me. Root of bitterness? Jealously maybe? Almost sounds like an angry ex-wife, or girlfriend, fiending over the fact that their ex-partner is still breathing.

Get over it boys and girls, the United Pentecostal Church is going to continue weather you like it or not.

In Jesus name

Brother Benincasa

www.OnTimeJournal.com

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Mr. Steinway

I am saddened by the decline of the UPCI because it's DNA flows through my veins. I still consider them "family".

IMO, they bent to the demands of the old guard for too long and are now paying the price. I honestly hope they find a way to turn things around.

What drama.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by freeatlast

Wow 9 pages...is it dead yet? I had heard it was on life support.

They should call in Stoneking and Ruth R. wave some uncut hair around....that'll bring it back from the dead ;-)

No, it is sitting back with a glass of sweet tea, and watching the sugar ants run crazy trying to find where the sweet tea is at.

[Monkeyman]

Originally Posted by CC1

Maple Syrup,

Any chance you are going to be rejoining the UPC in Canada to help jumpstart this growth?

Si Si Juan, Maple Syrup would be welcome at our church but he would have to leave his banjo & tambourine home

[Maple Leaf]

Originally Posted by Monkeyman

Si Si Juan, Maple Syrup would be welcome at our church but he would have to leave his banjo & tambourine home

The UPC hasn't been the same since they lost their accordions.

It used to be that you couldn't even be considered a church unless you had a minimum of one accordion for every 25 members.

My pastor used to play a mean tambourine. I haven't heard a good tambourine shaking in years.

There you go folks, the decline of the UPC is the direct result of the loss of accordions and tambourines.

BTW - I've got an acoustic-electric bass for sale if your church would like to get closer to God.

[Barb]

Originally Posted by Sandra

At because of the times, the general sup. Kenneth haney said" Fathers encourage your sons to preach the gospel, we are getting no applications from men under the age of 45" .



I stand by my statement ITS DYING ! SANDRA

Originally Posted by ManOfWord

I honestly don't relish in the death of any org really. I don't wish to write the UPCI's epitaph nor will I dance on the grave. However, change is inevitable....misery is optional!

The problem is that the UPCI has labelled so many things sin which are not labelled sin in the scripture, that it would be extremely embarrassing and assaulting its integrity, to back track. However, Jesus stated that TRUTH would set the captive free. Until one is willing to face the truth, they will continually use their energy to hide it! Fear is a terrible taskmaster and an enemy of TRUTH.

I am a holiness preacher. I believe that when we are saved that we are saved FROM something. That SOMETHING is sin! We should be able to say, "That is what I WAS and this is what I AM!"

But we should also be willing to proclaim biblical truth and let convictions stand to the bearer. That's my opinion and I'm stickin' to it! LD

Originally Posted by Sherri

I think this thread is sad.

Originally Posted by Maple Leaf

To tell the truth, my post was somewhat tongue-in-cheek.

Honestly, I'm not sure that Sandra isn't, at least, partially right, but I'm a long way from giggling about it.

The decline of the UPC is not good news for anybody in our baby killing, same-sex marrying, prozac popping, pleasure loving world.

Originally Posted by Mr. Steinway

I am saddened by the decline of the UPCI because it's DNA flows through my veins. I still consider them "family".

Wasn't going to jump in here, but the posts quoted above rather jumped out at me...

For the record, though I don't share Sandra Sue's excitement or agree on every point, I understand where is coming from because, this is how she views it from her house.

The view from our individual porches will be different, and it is based on experiences and personal convictions and principles.

And as I already have a full-time job keeping my own convictions and principles in line, I hardly have time to concern myself with what others say or do.

I would, however, like to share a few thoughts regarding joy in division...

Someone posted on another thread the other day that they would be "happy" to see the UPCI fold.

Why would this make anyone happy?!

Certainly it can be said that there is no perfect situation or church or organization or home or job or family or PERSON.

Wherever we find people we can count on there being problems, and just because the United Pentecostal Church, International is a ministerial alliance, it is not exempt from this.

There are a zillion things I could list where I disagree with the UPCI, and where, IMHO, they have erred in judgment.

But to say that it would bring me joy to see the organization fold or split again...no way!!

How many have ever been through a church split?!

Well, I have, and it ain't pretty. The hurt and the damage it does to relationships, with families divided...the bickering and backbiting that goes on in the name of "I'm right and you're wrong!!"

It's tragic, and some never recover from it. Others do move on, and I like to think that I have, yet this morning I admit it is heart wrenching for me to even speak of these things, though it was 7 years ago.

The UPCI is made up of people...good people, regardless of problems or disagreements or whatever.

There are ministers and their families, congregations, and missionaries who have longstanding ties and fellowship with each other, and the pain of separation for some will be just as great as the church split I mentioned.

I see no happiness to be found in any of it...

My prayer is that if changes do come, they are Scripture based and God ordained.

And might I add, my respect for those quoted above grows daily...having a different view, yet honoring your past is a wonderful thing.

[Irreligious]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

The issue is not "foaming at the mouth"...in fact the UPCI has had meetings with Trinitarians to come to a peaceful consensus.

The problem the younger generation has with the UPC are what appears to be man made traditions amoung other things. There are enough in the UPC that don't "foam at the mouth" at the mention of the word Trinity.

Not enough "that foam at the mouth"? Yes.....because whether or not there are three "persons" or three "manifestations" or whatever word you use, is a GREAT way to spend our time, isn't it? That right there is CERTAINLY worth foaming at the mouth. Any so-called "trinitarian" or so-called "oneness person" is wasting their time if they give a hoot in hades about it. Both are monotheistic and believe the SAME THING!!! Is "Eternal Sonship" really worth a 100+-year war?? You say there's one God? There isn't a trinitarian on the planet that would disagree (except the Herbert W. Armstrong group and no one takes them seriously).

I've been gone from Pentecostalism since '93 and I can't remember the last time I thought about the word "trinitarian" or "oneness" until I accidently stumbled onto this blog.

I still just challenge you mouth-foamers to NEVER read a Jim Cymbala or Max Lucado book or EVER sing a Bill Gaither or Andrae Crouch song. If people, like them, believe that "there is One God eternally existing as three persons", and if they are completely in "false doctrine" then don't sing the songs or read the books of these "deceived" people. It's hypocrisy.

[Monkeyman]

Originally Posted by Barb

Wasn't going to jump in here, but the posts quoted above rather jumped out at me...

For the record, though I don't share Sandra Sue's excitement or agree on every point, I understand where is coming from because, this is how she views it from her house.

The view from our individual porches will be different, and it is based on experiences and personal convictions and principles.

And as I already have a full-time job keeping my own convictions and principles in line, I hardly have time to concern myself with what others say or do.

I would, however, like to share a few thoughts regarding joy in division...

Someone posted on another thread the other day that they would be "happy" to see the UPCI fold.

Why would this make anyone happy?!

Certainly it can be said that there is no perfect situation or church or organization or home or job or family or PERSON.

Wherever we find people we can count on there being problems, and just because the United Pentecostal Church, International is a ministerial alliance, it is not exempt from this.

There are a zillion things I could list where I disagree with the UPCI, and where, IMHO, they have erred in judgment.

But to say that it would bring me joy to see the organization fold or split again...no way!!

How many have ever been through a church split?!

Well, I have, and it ain't pretty. The hurt and the damage it does to relationships, with families divided...the bickering and backbiting that goes on in the name of "I'm right and you're wrong!!"

It's tragic, and some never recover from it. Others do move on, and I like to think that I have, yet this morning I admit it is heart wrenching for me to even speak of these things, though it was 7 years ago.

The UPCI is made up of people...good people, regardless of problems or disagreements or whatever.

There are ministers and their families, congregations, and missionaries who have longstanding ties and fellowship with each other, and the pain of separation for some will be just as great as the church split I mentioned.

I see no happiness to be found in any of it...

My prayer is that if changes do come, they are Scripture based and God ordained.

And might I add, my respect for those quoted above grows daily...having a different view, yet honoring your past is a wonderful thing.

Why thank you...thank you very much! You're not so bad yourself.