Baptism question for One-Steppers

[Jack Shephard]

Originally Posted by CC1

Every person coming to Christ ought to be anxious to be baptized as it signifies a change of allegience from self to that of the Lord Jesus Christ. A visible outward action on the part of the believer.

PERFECT

[Praxeas]

"Call upon" is the middle voice

middle —The grammatical voice that signifies that the subject of the verb is being affected by its own action or is acting upon itself.

Heiser, M. S. (2005; 2005). Glossary of Morpho-Syntactic Database Terminology (middle). Logos Bible Software.



Im curious if anyone knows greek. Could this possibly mean that by Paul's action "to get yourself baptized"

It's interesting it's use is religious and legal.

It's in the middle voice. If Paul is the subject is he appealing to Christ's legal authority?

The mid. ἐπικαλέομαί τινα, “to appeal to someone” (on one`s behalf or in one’s favour) is a common legal term in the NT (Lat. provocare [ad]).

Παῦλος ἐπικαλεῖται Καίσαρα, “Paul appeals to,” “makes an appeal to Caesar,” Ac. 25:11, 12, 25 (here, instead of Καίσαρα, τὸν Σεβαστόν, Augustus); 26:32; 28:19. The absolute use is also found in this sense at Ac. 25:21: Paul appeals to be reserved to the decision of Augustus. A similar, though less technical, use is found at 2 C. 1:23: μάρτυρα τὸν θεὸν ἐπικαλοῦμαι ἐπὶ τὴν ἐμὴν ψυχήν, “I call God to witness against my soul (i.e., against me).”3

Often in the NT the believer calls on God or Christ, or the name of God or Christ, in prayer: Ac. 2:21: ὃς ἐὰν ἐπικαλέσηται τὸ ὄνομα κυρίου (== Jl. 3:5); cf. R. 10:13; Ac. 7:59: … τὸν Στέφανον ἐπικαλούμενον καὶ λέγοντα· κύριε Ἰησοῦ (in this absolute verbal use the vocative replaces the accusative of object); 9:14: τοὺς ἐπικαλουμένους τὸ ὄνομά σου (sc. Χριστοῦ, or less likely θεοῦ); 9:21: … τὸ ὄνομα τοῦτο; 22:16: … τὸ ὄνομα αὐτοῦ (sc. θεοῦ); R. 10:12: … αὐτόν (sc. Χριστόν rather than θεόν); cf. 10:13 (→ 499) and 14; 1 C. 1:2: … τὸ ὄνομα τοῦ κυρίου ἡμῶν Ἰησοῦ Χριστοῦ; 2 Tm. 2:22: … τὸν κύριον (A reads ἀγαπώντων for ἐπικαλουμένων, and this offers a useful commentary); 1 Pt. 1:17: … πατέρα (cf. ψ 88:26).

NT New Testament.

Lat. Latin, latin.

3 Cf. Deissmann LO, 258, where we have the material par.. from Ditt. Or., II, 532, 28 ff.: ἐπαρῶμαι αὐτός τε κατʼ ἐμοῦ καὶ α[ώμα]τος τοῦ ἐμαυτοῦ καὶ ψυχῆς καὶ βίου κτλ.

Theological dictionary of the New Testament. 1964-c1976. Vols. 5-9 edited by Gerhard Friedrich. Vol. 10 compiled by Ronald Pitkin. (G. Kittel, G. W. Bromiley & G. Friedrich, Ed.) (electronic ed.) (3:497). Grand Rapids, MI: Eerdmans.



Is Paul then appealing to Christ's legal authority by being baptized???

[Praxeas]

It's the blood that remits sin...the blood of Jesus which He already shed, but unless you are Carlton Pearson or Crackjac or whatever, you don't believe that means everyone is forgiven already. Rather there is a place and time when the blood is applied.

Some have argued it is at the moment of faith, before there is even a decision to repent. Others by faith AT repentance. And clearly we have some by faith AT baptism.

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by pelathais

You're preaching to the choir about "faith AND obedience" here, Bro.

But, how did John's disciples get "remission of sins" without the name of Jesus being used in baptism? Mark 1:4, Luke 1:77 and Luke 3:3.

The were baptized with remission of sins in view Calvary was NOT thus they were baptized looking forward to remission of sins. However John's disciples were rebaptized recieving remission of sins in HIs Name. Acts. 19:5

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by JTTNMinistries

Jesus was in heaven while on earth (John 3:13). As to His Deity He is omnipresent, gathered in thousands of places simultaneously wherever two or three are gathered. As to His begotten Sonship He was limited to one place.

The singular name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost is Jesus.

Thank you.

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by JTTNMinistries

No, you are understanding wrong. Father is not a name. Son is not a name. Jesus is the name of MT 28:19. It does not say "baptize them in the name of the Father, the name of the Son, the name of the Holy Spirit" as if there were three names. There is one Name that the F, S, and H.S. share and that Name is Jesus.

Jesus said when you have seen Him you have seen the Father (John 14:9). John 10:30 is the verse where Jesus says that He is One with the Father


Just a side note: please reply to specific posts and not a general reply to the initial post so we can track the flow of this conversation easier. Just reply to the specific post that of the person it is directed towards.

Amen.

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Some view the "wash away your sins" with "calling on the name of the Lord", which is what the candidate was supposed to do
Rom 10
9 because, if myou confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and nbelieve in your heart othat God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. 11 For the Scripture says, p“Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame.” 12 qFor there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; rfor the same Lord is Lord of all, sbestowing his riches on all who call on him. 13 For t“everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” m Matt. 10:32; Luke 12:8; [1 Cor. 12:3; Phil. 2:11]

n See Acts 16:31

o [1 Pet. 1:21]; See Acts 2:24

p See ch. 9:33

q See ch. 3:22, 29

r Acts 10:36

s See ch. 2:4

t Acts 2:21; Cited from Joel 2:32

The Holy Bible : English standard version. 2001 (Ro 10:9-13). Wheaton: Standard Bible Society.

Here is an interesting thought though. Looking at the greek, "baptized" is "active" which is why the greek word is translated "be baptized" or "get yourself baptized" and is a "Imperative" which means this was a command or a exhortation. Paul was commanded to "immerse yourself" or "have yourself immersed" or "get yourself baptized".

The conjunction "kai" connects "get yourself baptized" with "wash away" and is Logical

logical —A conjunction that relates the flow of thought from one phrase, clause or passage to another phrase, clause, or passage by expressing logical relationships between those items.

Heiser, M. S. (2005; 2005). Glossary of Morpho-Syntactic Database Terminology (logical). Logos Bible Software.



And Connective

connective —A conjunction that connects an additional idea or grammatical element (word, phrase, clause) to a previous idea or grammatical element. For example, the connective conjunction may serve to logically continue a narrative (“…and Jesus said”) or to associate two items that, in the context, are together the mutual focus of the clause (“Aquila and Priscilla taught Apollos”)

Heiser, M. S. (2005; 2005). Glossary of Morpho-Syntactic Database Terminology (connective). Logos Bible Software.

BTW apparently only in the TR does the word for Lord appear. In other texts and MSS it's just "call on His name" or "Call upon the name of Him"

The text is on the MIDDLE voice thus a third party is baptized and invoking the name. There are NO self baptisms in the NT.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

The text is on the MIDDLE voice thus a third party is baptized and invoking the name. There are NO self baptisms in the NT.

lol, Brother Steve I was not suggesting he baptized himself. He was commanded to get himself or be baptized, not to baptize himself

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

lol, Brother Steve I was not suggesting he baptized himself. He was commanded to get himself or be baptized, not to baptize himself

The baptizers are commanded to baptize in the name Mt. 28:19 NOT the one being baptized. The argument is absurd.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

The baptizers are commanded to baptize in the name Mt. 28:19 NOT the one being baptized. The argument is absurd.

Steve, again I am not arguing what you keep saying I am. What I posted did NOT suggest Paul was to baptize himself nor in the name of Paul...good grief lol