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06-09-2008, 09:46 AM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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Re: Christ Church Pastor Change
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sister Alvear
I thought Father Son and Holy Ghost refered to Him...He is all this and more.
Well that is just a thought...am still traveling...stopped at a little place where they are lettting me use their internet.
Maybe CC might want an woman for the pastor..Maybe they should send me the papers to fill out...ha...boy that would be a change!
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Yes I know sister. But, if by "HIM" you mean Jesus Christ, then it become at least a bit problematic when Jesus (the Father, Son and Holy Spirit) says "I go unto the Father in heaven".
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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06-09-2008, 09:51 AM
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Jesus is the Christ
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 1,484
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Re: Christ Church Pastor Change
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
Yes I know sister. But, if by "HIM" you mean Jesus Christ, then it become at least a bit problematic when Jesus (the Father, Son and Holy Spirit) says "I go unto the Father in heaven".
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Be careful Stephen -- You might incur the wrath of Epley!
__________________
If ye believe not that I AM, ye shall die in your sins. John 8:24
Mone me, amabo te, si erro
No real problem exists over the use of "The Name" in everthing else done in the Church. Why then should there exist great controversy over the use of the "The Name of the Godhead" in water baptism?
Kevin J. Conner The Name of God p. 92
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06-09-2008, 09:57 AM
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Administrator
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,840
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Re: Christ Church Pastor Change
Here are some of the NT scriptures that I think make some Oneness folks uncomfortable or at least talks in the same language that they accuse makes trinitarians polytheistic;
John 6:44 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain
44No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Matthew 10:32 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain
32Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.
I find this one fascinating because Jesus doesn't say HE will confess them but that he will confess them "before my father".
1 John 1:3 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain
3That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.
More verbage making a distinction between the Father and Jesus. This and many more scriptures refer seperately to the Father and Jesus. I have wonndered why they did not state it something lke "....with the Father which is Jesus Christ" or "....with the Father, Jesus Christ. It seems in the NT a distinction is consistently made.
Then of course there is also the scripture S Hoove pointed out a few posts above where Jesus says "I go to my Father".
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06-09-2008, 10:02 AM
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Cross-examine it!
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Orcutt, CA.
Posts: 6,736
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Re: Christ Church Pastor Change
Quote:
Originally Posted by CC1
Here are some of the NT scriptures that I think make some Oneness folks uncomfortable or at least talks in the same language that they accuse makes trinitarians polytheistic;
John 6:44 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain
44No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Matthew 10:32 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain
32Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.
I find this one fascinating because Jesus doesn't say HE will confess them but that he will confess them "before my father".
1 John 1:3 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain
3That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.
More verbage making a distinction between the Father and Jesus. This and many more scriptures refer seperately to the Father and Jesus. I have wonndered why they did not state it something lke "....with the Father which is Jesus Christ" or "....with the Father, Jesus Christ. It seems in the NT a distinction is consistently made.
Then of course there is also the scripture S Hoove pointed out a few posts above where Jesus says "I go to my Father". |
How about John 5:16 through about chapter 7? When I was Bible quizzing and we did the book of John we skipped those 3 chapters.
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06-09-2008, 10:04 AM
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My Family!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Collierville, TN
Posts: 31,786
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Re: Christ Church Pastor Change
The way I've always viewed it is God, the father is a spirit and everywhere.
God became flesh when Jesus was born, HOWEVER, God the spirit didn't cease to exist outside of Jesus.
It seems that many oneness people just focus on Jesus and God being one so intently that they forget that GOD is a spirit that is everywhere - - he's not just contained in Jesus.
It seems so simple to me.
__________________
Master of Science in Applied Disgruntled Religious Theorist Wrangling
PhD in Petulant Tantrum Quelling
Dean of the School of Hard Knocks
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06-09-2008, 10:11 AM
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Supercalifragilisticexpiali...
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 19,197
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Re: Christ Church Pastor Change
Quote:
Originally Posted by rgcraig
The way I've always viewed it is God, the father is a spirit and everywhere.
God became flesh when Jesus was born, HOWEVER, God the spirit didn't cease to exist outside of Jesus.
It seems that many oneness people just focus on Jesus and God being one so intently that they forget that GOD is a spirit that is everywhere - - he's not just contained in Jesus.
It seems so simple to me.
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You are on the right track. The distinctions between the Father and the Son are external rather than internal to Jesus Christ.
__________________
"It is inhumane, in my opinion, to force people who have a genuine medical need for coffee to wait in line behind people who apparently view it as some kind of recreational activity." Dave Barry 2005
I am a firm believer in the Old Paths
Articles on such subjects as "The New Birth," will be accepted, whether they teach that the new birth takes place before baptism in water and Spirit, or that the new birth consists of baptism of water and Spirit. - THE PENTECOSTAL HERALD Dec. 1945
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves
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06-09-2008, 10:12 AM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 11,903
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Re: Christ Church Pastor Change
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover
Quite simply that the "I go unto my Father" scriptures are not exactly candy-stick Oneness scriptures traditionally, especially for those who have taught Jesus IS the Father.
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They are if you are really Oneness no problem whatsoever. Jesus is the Father INCARNATE that did not destroy God being Omnipresent and Heaven being His throne.
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06-09-2008, 10:14 AM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 11,903
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Re: Christ Church Pastor Change
Quote:
Originally Posted by rgcraig
The way I've always viewed it is God, the father is a spirit and everywhere.
God became flesh when Jesus was born, HOWEVER, God the spirit didn't cease to exist outside of Jesus.
It seems that many oneness people just focus on Jesus and God being one so intently that they forget that GOD is a spirit that is everywhere - - he's not just contained in Jesus.
It seems so simple to me.
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Very simple but it's seems Bro. Hoover missed this class?
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06-09-2008, 10:15 AM
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Administrator
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,840
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Re: Christ Church Pastor Change
Quote:
Originally Posted by rgcraig
The way I've always viewed it is God, the father is a spirit and everywhere.
God became flesh when Jesus was born, HOWEVER, God the spirit didn't cease to exist outside of Jesus.
It seems that many oneness people just focus on Jesus and God being one so intently that they forget that GOD is a spirit that is everywhere - - he's not just contained in Jesus.
It seems so simple to me.
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Yup. If you don't acknowledge that there was God beyond the physical body of Jesus it makes a lot of scriptures very difficult.
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06-09-2008, 10:17 AM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 11,903
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Re: Christ Church Pastor Change
Quote:
Originally Posted by CC1
Yup. If you don't acknowledge that there was God beyond the physical body of Jesus it makes a lot of scriptures very difficult.
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CC1 the only people I have met who believes anything like this are what we called "Jesus Only" folks in Ky. they were illiterate to say the least.
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