Free Seattle

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Its getting to be a place where less and less people want to be.

But that is because of everyone else? None of it would be your fault Melissa?

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

So it would appear based on the fact you believe Revelation 1-19 has all taken place that these events must have occured in the past, specifically in 70ad.

The marriage of the Lamb. 19:7-9
The coming of Jesus Christ with the armies of Heaven. 19:11
The defeat of the nations and the wrath of God. 19:15
The beast and his prophet were cast into the lake of fire. 19:20
His armies were slain by Jesus Christ. 19:21

This is the difference between what they call "futurism" and "preterism".

A "futurist" believes these things are yet to happen in the future.

A "preterist" view is all these things are past.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

This is the difference between what they call "futurism" and "preterism".

A "futurist" believes these things are yet to happen in the future.

A "preterist" view is all these things are past.

We aren't the bride of Christ, now?

What does 666 mean?


Also Mike, you NEVER even dealt with my previous post.

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Now on a thread thats entitled "Free Seattle" the warriors for no Jews matter, partial preterism and historicism are here to do battle! To pray for Seattle?

No. To rob the end time believer of the light Jesus gave.

When you see these things begin to happen look up your redemption draws near.

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Now you don't believe people can be redeemed by the Cross?


When you see these things begin to happen look up your redemption draws near.

Yet, 16 verses before the above verse we read......


Luke 21:12 But before all these, they shall lay their hands on you, and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues, and into prisons, being brought before kings and rulers for my name's sake.

Mike, so tell me? We are going to be brought before Jewish courts? You one day look for a time which you will face a Beth din? Ah, sure, good luck with the Marvel Universe.

Mike, DO YOU BELIEVE in our near future we the Christian community will be dragged before Jewish religious courts. If you say no, then you CAN'T say Luke 21 applies to our future.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Bro, the Admin doesn't have to do anything. Some men need to act like men, and stop behaving like teenage girls when they feel slighted. Pretty much Mike acts like a girl at times. Complains about things which no one honestly cares about. Everyone is here to have fun, but Mike is a ecclesiastical high school diva, and see everyone else "Especially those who believe in Brand X eschatology" as his opponents. Go back and follow everything from Mike wanting to start a hair pulling contest with Brother Blume. His great zeal in wanting to expose the PRETERISTS, is got old a long time ago. He stirs the stink, and then when he gets a punch in the nose he starts to whine like he broke a nail. Through runny mascara weeping eyes he brings our attention to the lack of audience on the forum (meaning that he no one here reading his revelations) but that has been explained to him. That with Facebook, and all the other social platforms out there Vbulletin forums are fossils. Other forums which were also like the Vbulletin here are ghost towns with just a few or none posting. Mike is gloom and doom, maybe because his eschatology is all about things constantly going to hell, and every bad news report to be relished because it just brings us a little closer to a brighter day.
But, it's all a carrot on a stick.

Mike, do you have bad posture? Do you slouch when you walk? Contemplate this on the tree of woe.

Blessings Dom.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Blessings Dom.

More Churchmen cursing? Because after all, it is just feigning a blessing upon me. Mike, what about my question? Luke 21 you brought up?

Luke 21:28
When everything I discussed with you starts to happen. Lift up your eyes because your redemption is coming near to you. Yet 16 verses before verse 28 which you quote for us to indicate its our future. Jesus' audience is clearly told that they will be brought before a Judean court called the Bet Din. Yet, you claim it is in our future. How do you explain this? Will there be a time when Christians will be dragged before the Bet Din (which isn't the same as the first century) and Luke 21:24 Jews being taken into slavery by every nation on earth? Jews will be made slaves? Future armies will no longer use guns but swords?

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Now you don't believe people can be redeemed by the Cross?


When you see these things begin to happen look up your redemption draws near.

Yet, 16 verses before the above verse we read......


Luke 21:12 But before all these, they shall lay their hands on you, and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues, and into prisons, being brought before kings and rulers for my name's sake.

Mike, so tell me? We are going to be brought before Jewish courts? You one day look for a time which you will face a Beth din? Ah, sure, good luck with the Marvel Universe.

People can be redeemed by what happened at the cross. Jesus was speaking about the day it becomes full reality.

Paul understood this.

Romans 8:22-23

22For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now. 23And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

Ephesians 4:30

30And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

So yes Jesus said when these things begin to happen your redemption is near. He meant the gathering together of the saints at a future time. The same concept as the resurrection of the dead and catching up of the saints.

Some cannot seem to see that there is a "spiritual" work in redemption but also a "literal" work. If one puts all the emphasis on the spiritual aspect and leaves out the literal we wind up with problems in rightly dividing the word of truth.

We are redeemed spiritually at present but in the FUTURE we will be literally redeemed. Actually and not just by faith. Like saying we are "saved" now but if we endure to the end we will be saved.

Altho Jesus was speaking to a Jewish audience in regard to the signs they were to watch for those things were not EXCLUSIVELY for the Jews.

Earthquakes in divers places, famines, pestilence, persecution of his disciples in all nations, not just in Judea. Signs in the sun and moon and tribulation so severe if Christ doesnt return to end it NO FLESH would be saved.

No flesh doesnt sound like hes just talking about a small place like Judea.

So the end generation will see all the signs unfolding before their redemption/resurrection.

[diakonos]

Please address being on trial in the synagogues.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by diakonos

Please address being on trial in the synagogues.

Some will be.

[coksiw]

Originally Posted by diakonos

Please address being on trial in the synagogues.

Jesus was prophesying. Prophecies in the Bible could be referring to two different events in the same passage. If you want to see precedents of that in the Bible itself, see the prophecies that the New Testament says that it was fulfilled in Jesus (e.g the first chapters in the book of Matthew), and then go back to the Old Testament and see the context in which it was said.
And in general, the best book to learn Bible prophecy is the Bible itself. See the prophecies that were told in the Bible and were also fulfilled, especially those that the Bible itself says that such event was the fulfillment of it.

Regarding the synagogues thing, Jesus said right before that there will be great signs, and pestilence, and such. Then he said, "before all these", setting a sequence of events (not a timeline).

That part of the prophecy definitely came to past, as the apostles suffered it. The part right before about the signs I don't think so. You would have to allegorized the part about great signs in the sky to believe so. But then, when do you stop allegorizing that prophecy? The context doesn't give any indication that that's a figure of speech.

The Bible has definitely figures of speech. You can find them by the context. But you can't take a figure of speech from one place to argue that in another place a phrase is a figure of speech as well (as some false doctrine teachers like to do to prove their point). You don't do that in your plain english speaking and literature. God used plain language with all their richness to speak to us. I can't say "I opened the door for him" is always a figure of speech because somebody used it in some book as a figure of speech. You have to look at the context to figure it out.

Going back to the prophecy, it follows the typical pattern of prophecies from a prophet in the Bible: prediction of short term events, which confirms the credibility of the prophet (Deut 18:18-22), and then long term events. For example, Jeremiah prophesied about the captivity (short term), but also of the coming of the Messiah (long term).

Nevertheless, Christians has always been judged and sent to prison for their believes. It is more like an ongoing thing anyway.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by coksiw

Jesus was prophesying. Prophecies in the Bible could be referring to two different events in the same passage. If you want to see precedents of that in the Bible itself, see the prophecies that the New Testament says that it was fulfilled in Jesus (e.g the first chapters in the book of Matthew), and then go back to the Old Testament and see the context in which it was said.
And in general, the best book to learn Bible prophecy is the Bible itself. See the prophecies that were told in the Bible and were also fulfilled, especially those that the Bible itself says that such event was the fulfillment of it.

Regarding the synagogues thing, Jesus said right before that there will be great signs, and pestilence, and such. Then he said, "before all these", setting a sequence of events (not a timeline).

That part of the prophecy definitely came to past, as the apostles suffered it. The part right before about the signs I don't think so. You would have to allegorized the part about great signs in the sky to believe so. But then, when do you stop allegorizing that prophecy? The context doesn't give any indication that that's a figure of speech.

The Bible has definitely figures of speech. You can find them by the context. But you can't take a figure of speech from one place to argue that in another place a phrase is a figure of speech as well (as some false doctrine teachers like to do to prove their point). You don't do that in your plain english speaking and literature. God used plain language with all their richness to speak to us. I can't say "I opened the door for him" is always a figure of speech because somebody used it in some book as a figure of speech. You have to look at the context to figure it out.

Going back to the prophecy, it follows the typical pattern of prophecies from a prophet in the Bible: prediction of short term events, which confirms the credibility of the prophet (Deut 18:18-22), and then long term events. For example, Jeremiah prophesied about the captivity (short term), but also of the coming of the Messiah (long term).

Nevertheless, Christians has always been judged and sent to prison for their believes. It is more like an ongoing thing anyway.

Exactly