Mark of the Beast may be only 2 1/2 years away

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by coksiw

Brother because the idea is first, it just hasn't happened yet according to this interpretation, second, when it happens, there will be little you can do to survive in such a large scale situation.

The inability to participate in the economy is not because of the rejection of means of payment themselves, but because what the means of payment entails. If you give me a card to participate in the economy I'll use it. But if you give me a card for the same, but first you demand that I deny the Lordship of Christ, and say the beast is the only Lord above everything, and I say "no thanks" to the card and suffer the consequences.

If I recall correctly from my readings, it is not the first time something similar happens. I recall emperors demanding that people do some idol worship, and then they are given a paper indicating they did it, and then allow them to enter the marketplace if they had that paper. Effectively, that becomes a mark of the beast, where you can't participate in the economy unless you worshiped de idol first.

That's the reasoning behind the doctrine, that something similar will happen. There may be a variety of teachers teaching variants of this, and some even embarrassing themselves, but in general, there is no worries that we are being marked right now since it is only a problem when the requirement to be part of the economy involves denying Christ.

What you described has in fact already happened. You even pointed out how. Thus, futurist insistence that the Biblical mark of the beast is some new thing "about to happen" is clearly wrong. Thus futurists NEVER "worry about being marked NOW", and thus every generation of futurists wind up being marked. It's ALWAYS "almost here" and never actually arrives.

[coksiw]

Originally Posted by Esaias

What you described has in fact already happened. You even pointed out how. Thus, futurist insistence that the Biblical mark of the beast is some new thing "about to happen" is clearly wrong. Thus futurists NEVER "worry about being marked NOW", and thus every generation of futurists wind up being marked. It's ALWAYS "almost here" and never actually arrives.

You are absolutely right. It will come in the way people won't expect it, and when it happens, many will deny it. It can also happen multiple times in history before the last short living human kingdom reaches its peak. One is as guilty for taking it whether that person is in the last human kingdom or in the one before. Even the last human kingdom may do some of the predicted things multiple times with failures in between.

[diakonos]

Good grief

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by coksiw

You are absolutely right. It will come in the way people won't expect it, and when it happens, many will deny it. It can also happen multiple times in history before the last short living human kingdom reaches its peak. One is as guilty for taking it whether that person is in the last human kingdom or in the one before. Even the last human kingdom may do some of the predicted things multiple times with failures in between.

The Book of the Revelation of Jesus Christ, is made to be understood only by its believers. The message therein is along the lines of Jesus' statements found in Mark 4:11-13. Therefore if you, or I cannot understand its contents then we have a little more to worry about than a mark. Many theories float around concerning the Beast, the Mark, and whether the destructions described in the Book will happen, whether or not we will be here, or not. But you brought up an interesting point, you speak of the last human kingdom? Would that be the feet mingled with Potters Clay and the Iron of Rome?

Can you please explain?

[Monterrey]

Ah yes, the 2k long toes.

[james34]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Something in the hand needed to buy or sell - literally?

Is the beast literally a seven headed monster that comes from the ocean? Is the second beast literally a two horned monster that crawls out of the dirt? Is the mark of God a church chip put in the forehead?

You say we "just have to agree to disagree". I say that's a cop out. I say you do not have Bible for what you are claiming, and do not want to investigate it.

Do you do church on Sunday? Easter? Christmas? One man pastor? A "holy although man made building = the house of God"?

Don't be afraid. I know it's easier to be concerned about some future event than it is to be concerned about one's current standing. But the easy road is usually the wrong road.

In any event, please consider the numerous Scriptures that have been presented to you. We need to speak as the Bible speaks, even if it isn't in vogue with the hot happening current trends.

One man pastor? I am troubled by this idea. How do you all interpret the use of this gift?

[coksiw]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

The Book of the Revelation of Jesus Christ, is made to be understood only by its believers. The message therein is along the lines of Jesus' statements found in Mark 4:11-13. Therefore if you, or I cannot understand its contents then we have a little more to worry about than a mark. Many theories float around concerning the Beast, the Mark, and whether the destructions described in the Book will happen, whether or not we will be here, or not. But you brought up an interesting point, you speak of the last human kingdom? Would that be the feet mingled with Potters Clay and the Iron of Rome?

Can you please explain?

I was just referring to this:

[Rev 17:10-11 KJV] 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, [and] the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. 11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

Just to clarify, I am not referring to one nation over the entire planet, but specifically to the last powerful human government that dominates other nations, a.k.a. empire, before the Lord takes over the government over the world.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by james34

One man pastor? I am troubled by this idea. How do you all interpret the use of this gift?

Is there a gift of "one man pastor"?

By one man pastor I mean what is otherwise known as the monarchical episcopate, the idea that every church has ONE GUY WHO IS ALWAYS IN CHARGE = other than JESUS. The idea that salvation is mitigated through this individual, that without being under the authority of this individual you aren't doing Christianity "right", that THIS ONE DUDE has been appointed by God to dispense the kingdom to you.

A Biblical pastor is a teacher who's job is to teach the doctrine of Christ.

A Biblical elder is a little different, not ALL elders are specifically teachers.

A Biblical bishop or overseer is different still, but is someone responsible for oversight of the church (and is supposed to be able to teach, though teaching may not be their primary function in the assembly) and is by definition supposed to be an elder.

There are supposed to be multiple overseers in the assembly if the assembly can produce them.

And the gifts of the Spirit are determined by how God actually uses people in the assembly (not by mere human appointment). Certain gifts both teaching and administrative are to be recognised by the assembly as qualifying people for eldership and oversight.

[Esaias]

What is interesting is the mark of the beast is only mentioned in the Revelation. No other NT writer warned about some implant/tattoo enforced by a global government/world dictator. Which tells us that the mark of the beast is a SYMBOL used by the Revelation to represent something taught by the other NT writers, namely a defining characteristic of the UNGODLY. As opposed to being some literal tattoo/implant.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Monterrey

Ah yes, the 2k long toes.

Go on, please explain?