Ferd you have presented a fairly moderate view on this issue .. you believe both retribution and rehabilitation are necessary ... I have to agree.
Implementation might be where we different ... barely ...
In terms of the punishment fitting the crime ... do you agree w/ the Supreme Court decision not to execute child rapists ... why or why not?
That is a very interesting question. I know for sure that the supreme court found this case warrented their review. On that point I totally disagree.
IMHO, the court over stepped. Not because I agree with Louisiana on the point, but because i dont believe there is a point of constitutional law that extends here.
On the law itself, there are certainly a lot of things to consider. child rape is one of the hightes for residivism. It distroys the childs life, for life. Some call it living death.
On the other hand, blood is required for blood. So I am not sure you can really do that? I dont know.
there are some points of criminal behavior that ought to be treated vastly different. the extremely violent. people convicted of first degree murder and rapists (of all kinds)
I wonder with some if it simply isnt best to completely remove them from society in general permanantly?
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
Ferd you have presented a fairly moderate view on this issue .. you believe both retribution and rehabilitation are necessary ... I have to agree.
Implementation might be where we differ ... barely ...
In terms of the punishment fitting the crime ... do you agree w/ the Supreme Court decision not to execute child rapists ... why or why not?
We might argue if it is an appropriate punishment. But was the Supreme Court wrong? Yes. They found the statute unconstitutional based on an "evolving standard" of cruel and unusual punishment. The Constitution should be read for what it says not how it has "evolved."
The Court claims to have identified “a national consensus” that the death penalty is never acceptable for the rape of a child;
Do you believe this to be true? The dissenters certainly didn’t and yet this was the bases of reinterpreting the 8th Amendment. You talk a lot about due process but that applies to more than just giving rights to criminals. The Court overstepped its bounds again.
__________________
"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
That is a very interesting question. I know for sure that the supreme court found this case warrented their review. On that point I totally disagree.
IMHO, the court over stepped. Not because I agree with Louisiana on the point, but because i dont believe there is a point of constitutional law that extends here.
On the law itself, there are certainly a lot of things to consider. child rape is one of the hightes for residivism. It distroys the childs life, for life. Some call it living death.
On the other hand, blood is required for blood. So I am not sure you can really do that? I dont know.
there are some points of criminal behavior that ought to be treated vastly different. the extremely violent. people convicted of first degree murder and rapists (of all kinds)
I wonder with some if it simply isnt best to completely remove them from society in general permanantly?
This would be a states rights issue for you then ... I can see this angle
The other day I was accused as not being a conservative because I believe that the punishment should meet the crime ...
In this case as you said blood for blood ...
I am for capital punishment ... and I believe that if a violent sexual offense accompanies a murder that the state should seek the death penalty ... I would assist if they needed my help.
However to say that all child rapists don't deserve to live ... and therefore be executed as one fellow conservative poster state here a few days ago ... flies in the face of what us death penalty proponents have been arguing for years ... this is an issue of just retribution.
And of course ... I need to vote for McCain to fix this ....
This public outcry to totally dehumanize all sexual offenders by not allowing them to participate in voluntary church activities (see Georgia) and even execute all child rapist for this heinous and violent act ... has me somewhat perturbed, Ferd.
Something is awry here .. and I'm trying to put my finger on it ...
This is not a conservative or liberal issue ...
In our modern republic we have not executed people for this before... but there is this wave of blood thirst that I believe is way too extreme for me.
You must not have read the decision because it makes specific reference to a child rapist being executed in 1964. Executed not strung up.
One execution over 40 years ago ??? C'mon Baron... as a general rule we have accepted as a society and in each our states this alone is not a capital offense ...
If you can prove to me otherwise ... that this has been common place than the Court is not far off in saying we have evolved ... common sense will tell you that
This would be a states rights issue for you then ... I can see this angle
The other day I was accused as not being a conservative because I believe that the punishment should meet the crime ...
In this case as you said blood for blood ...
I am for capital punishment ... and I believe that if a violent sexual offense accompanies a murder that the state should seek the death penalty ... I would assist if they needed my help.
However to say that all child rapists don't deserve to live ... and therefore be executed as one fellow conservative poster state here a few days ago ... flies in the face of what us death penalty proponents have been arguing for years ... this is an issue of just retribution.
And of course ... I need to vote for McCain to fix this ....
This public outcry to totally dehumanize all sexual offenders by not allowing them to participate in voluntary church activities (see Georgia) and even execute all child rapist for this heinous and violent act ... has me somewhat perturbed, Ferd.
Something is awry here .. and I'm trying to put my finger on it ...
This is not a conservative or liberal issue ...
In our modern republic we have not executed people for this before... but there is this wave of blood thirst that I believe is way too extreme for me.
Dan, I think this kind of thing is a reaction to a sense of helplessness/frustration with the current system. Politicans are all too willing to tap into those feelings and capitalize on it by offering a popular (if viseral and extreme) solution. Kill the guy! everyone agrees. but why?
because we know we dont have a system that deals effectivly with criminals on any level, much less these deviant sexual predators. So out of frustration we drill down to the least common denominator. Kill that guy.
When in fact, what should govern punisment is, what was the cost to society? what are the future ramifications of this person being free?
It all fits into the same puzzle. Crime is dealt with in this country based on the most recient thing people see on the news. if a baby is raped.... and it is reported on, we want to deal with it. if it isnt on the nightly news every night for a week, we dont care. that is sick.
the entire system is broken. until we fix the entire system....which includes cleaning up entire neighborhoods, and demanding acountablility from parents and teenagers to complete school, we will continue down a path where far too many in this country are locked up and there is far too much violent crime.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
One execution over 40 years ago ??? C'mon Baron... as a general rule we have accepted as a society and in each our states this alone is not a capital offense ...
If you can prove to me otherwise than the Court is not far off in saying we have evolved ... common sense will tell you that
Relax I was bating you...
Majority opinion p. 16
In 1925, 18 States, the District of Columbia, and the Federal Government had statutes that authorized the death penalty for the rape of a child or an adult. See Coker, supra, at 593 (plurality opinion). Between 1930 and 1964, 455 people were executed for those crimes.
Dissent on page 54
but the Court fails to mention that litigation regarding the constitutionality of the death penalty brought executions to a halt across the board in the late 1960’s. In 1965 and 1966, there were a total of eight executions for all offenses, and from 1968 until 1977, the year when Coker was decided, there were no executions for any crimes.
__________________
"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
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