*** [Exclusive] Resolution 3: The Bloodbath and Inquisition begins ****

[delta soundman]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

Again ... just common courtesy to give this pastor some time to make contingency plans ... ONE DAY BEFORE THE CRUSADE???

Signs,TV advertisement, and flyers have been up for weeks. The local, interim pastor made a call to the DS complaining.The DS was ever so happy to help out the elder bishop..........

[SDG]

Originally Posted by delta soundman

Signs,TV advertisement, and flyers have been up for weeks. The local, interim pastor made a call to the DS complaining.The DS was ever so happy to help out the elder bishop..........

Disgusted.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

...
So my question first would be WHY is the EVANGELIST not going to the local UPC church instead??

maybe they didn't invite him?

[Hoovie]

Originally Posted by delta soundman

Signs,TV advertisement, and flyers have been up for weeks. The local, interim pastor made a call to the DS complaining.The DS was ever so happy to help out the elder bishop..........

I think they should go through with it. Maybe...

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

Bro, I hope you know I can be just as anti UPC as the next man , I think for the most part Orgs are just walls of disunity and separation to the body of Christ.

But to me if a man is in an org, he should have some kind of loyalty while in it. And that should include not stepping on a UPC pastor in the same city in order to go to a Non UPC church. It just don't sit right with me. The same courtesy should be shown to the local UPC assembly of having a revival to help them first prior to going across the city to another that is not UPC.

I could be wrong, but it just doesn't sit right with me.

As a church planter, I can see your point.

But it's time we mature past territorialism.

WE do not own this, God does.

Friend this whole thing is unraveling before our very eyes. The number of men, from both sides of the ideological divide, who are leaving is mind-blowing.

Let me be clear. Resolution four did nothing to stem the tide of men on the left leaving. It only opened the door for men on the right to leave.

Perhaps God's immediate plan is bigger than any organization?

He will have a church. Perhaps it will look somewhat different than we had been led to believe, but He WILL have a church.

[stmatthew]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

I did not say working against ME, I said IN MANY WAYS working against the LOCAL UPC ASSEMBLY.


I honestly don't care one way or the other. To me, if the Kingdom is built, go for it! But put yourself in the position of that local home missions church pastor that is struggling to grow his church, and along comes a man IN HIS ORG, and goes across town to hold a crusade for a NON UPC church.

My first impression is that the evangelist must be too big to go help the home missions church, cause they will not be able to give him a BIG OFFERING.

Of course all this is supposition because you have not really presented ALL the pertinent info for us to come to a really logical and balance conclusion on the matter.

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

Who owns the church?

I thought this was God's kingdom.

Not ours.

Why not highlight this part??

So it would not bother you if some big name UPC preacher came to your city and preached in the local ultra con church across town, and drew some of the saints that God has called you to watch over to the ultracon church?? You would be ok with possibly loosing saints to another church that could afford the big gun??

If you are, then you are probably a bigger man than I, cause I would have some issues with it.

[stmatthew]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

Disgusted.

Dan, Its Politics. and even though I have played the DA position here, I agree with you.

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

Why not highlight this part??

So it would not bother you if some big name UPC preacher came to your city and preached in the local ultra con church across town, and drew some of the saints that God has called you to watch over to the ultracon church?? You would be ok with possibly loosing saints to another church that could afford the big gun??

If you are, then you are probably a bigger man than I, cause I would have some issues with it.

There was a time when it would have bothered me, but no more Matthew.

No man can move anyone God wants to plant in the assembly I pastor, and no attempts at pastoral control will cause them to stay if God wants them to leave.

I have learned this lesson the hard way. The very, very hard way.

I have lived what I am typing about.

It's tough to do, but these are not my people - they are God's.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by RandyWayne

It scares me to think about how much of that I'M guilty of just being me! Ok, maybe I haven't shed any innocent blood -yet, but the rest has occasionally wormed its way in........

We shed innocent blood when we backstab or cut up people or pass along rumors.
We can kill a minister and his/her ministry by gossip, innuendo, slander, and blackballing.

[anapko]

Originally Posted by stmatthew

Without ALL of the info, all I see is that a DS did what was well within his authority to do. We have no info one way or the other about the newly independent minister.


To be honest, I thought this had been the case for years. In order for a preacher to go into another area and preach for a church that is non- UPC, he must first get the approval of the local UPC pastor and the DS. At least that is what I thought was the case.

Don't mean to disagree with you bro but to ascribe authority on a whim as resolution 3 apparently does, does not justify forbidding said preacher one day before the meeting is to start. Common courtesy, decency, etc. is in order. I don't have much respect for said DS!