Homosexuality Or Legalism--Which Is Worse?

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by tv1a

It's a no brainer....

Homosexuals are not the driving force behind the Apostolic movement; legalists are. Thus if you've had negative experiences with the Apostolic movement it's only natural to see "legalists" as "more unpleasant" than other groups.

I would submit, that the homosexuals that you have in mind, perhaps coworkers, neighbors, etc; are "more pleasant to be around" simply because they are "more pleasant" individuals. That's why you interact with them in some way- they're nonthreatening and on the job even necessary associations for you.

I further submit that perhaps you have been fortunate enough not to be constantly exposed to the dregs of "gay culture" and "gay activism." There are plenty of homosexuals that I would like to see locked up in the same room as some of our "unpleasant legalists."

I'm just saying...

[pelathais]

In ancient cultures - and many modern ones, "homosexual behavior" is an important part of the male dominance hierarchy. The "dominant" male in the relationship is not considered "gay" or effeminate. He's a "man's man" and is taking control. In America we see this played out mostly in our prisons. In the Middle East where homosexuality is condemned officially by Islam- the dominant male's behavior is excused while his victims are mocked and condemned.

I think that it is this type of dominance that we all find repugnant when we think of the evils of homosexual behavior. It's simply a twisted way for men to organize themselves. It's abusive, manipulative and controlling. And, the non-sexual manifestations are very similar to what we have seen from our "legalists."

Legalists are abusive, manipulative and controlling. For me, after having spent some time studying anthropology, the legalist is as repulsive as the homosexual. I tend to lump their destructive behaviors together. I often felt defiled after an encounter with a manipulative legalist. I sat in a board meeting once that I could only describe as being akin to a homosexual gang rape.

Anthropologist Ann Druyan (Carl Sagan's widow) describes behaviors among chimpanzees (cannibalism, throwing feces, marking territories, sex for status) that mirror dysfunctional churches.

[tv1a]

There are few homosexuals I would love see locked up with some legalists.

I know about gay activsm and gay culture. I know their agenda. Although there may be others who are more knowledgable, I have dialogued with homosexuals. I've worked with homosexuals. I've observed that lifestyle closely. I've asked a lot of questions.

On the other hand, attempting to communicate with a legalist is like a dog attempting to communicate with a fire hydrant. In this case, I'm the fire hydrant.

Originally Posted by pelathais

Homosexuals are not the driving force behind the Apostolic movement; legalists are. Thus if you've had negative experiences with the Apostolic movement it's only natural to see "legalists" as "more unpleasant" than other groups.

I would submit, that the homosexuals that you have in mind, perhaps coworkers, neighbors, etc; are "more pleasant to be around" simply because they are "more pleasant" individuals. That's why you interact with them in some way- they're nonthreatening and on the job even necessary associations for you.

I further submit that perhaps you have been fortunate enough not to be constantly exposed to the dregs of "gay culture" and "gay activism." There are plenty of homosexuals that I would like to see locked up in the same room as some of our "unpleasant legalists."

I'm just saying...

[RevDWW]

Originally Posted by pelathais

In ancient cultures - and many modern ones, "homosexual behavior" is an important part of the male dominance hierarchy. The "dominant" male in the relationship is not considered "gay" or effeminate. He's a "man's man" and is taking control. In America we see this played out mostly in our prisons. In the Middle East where homosexuality is condemned officially by Islam- the dominant male's behavior is excused while his victims are mocked and condemned.

I think that it is this type of dominance that we all find repugnant when we think of the evils of homosexual behavior. It's simply a twisted way for men to organize themselves. It's abusive, manipulative and controlling. And, the non-sexual manifestations are very similar to what we have seen from our "legalists."

Legalists are abusive, manipulative and controlling. For me, after having spent some time studying anthropology, the legalist is as repulsive as the homosexual. I tend to lump their destructive behaviors together. I often felt defiled after an encounter with a manipulative legalist. I sat in a board meeting once that I could only describe as being akin to a homosexual gang rape.

Anthropologist Ann Druyan (Carl Sagan's widow) describes behaviors among chimpanzees (cannibalism, throwing feces, marking territories, sex for status) that mirror dysfunctional churches.

So you get your views of the Church from a dysfunctional atheist?

[tv1a]

If Paul can quote pagan poets in his writings and his sermons, pelathais can cite a dysfunctional athiest. Biblical prinicple already established. No way around it. Someone quoted Bob Dylan (the singer, not the poster) in another post.

Originally Posted by RevDWW

So you get your views of the Church from a dysfunctional atheist?

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by RevDWW

So you get your views of the Church from a dysfunctional atheist?

I wouldn't call her "dysfunctional" nor an "atheist." I've only spoken to her over the phone but I've read a couple of her books. I think she can be generally described as a "person of faith." In my current line of work I provide technical support to academics at times. I've been doing this for just a few years.

My views of "the Church," or "the Apostolic movement" is based upon a life long association and full time work within the ministry that covered a couple of decades.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by pelathais

I wouldn't call her "dysfunctional" nor an "atheist." I've only spoken to her over the phone but I've read a couple of her books. In my current line of work I provide technical support to academics at times. I've been doing this for just a few years.

My views of "the Church," or "the Apostolic movement" is based upon a life long association and full time work within the ministry that covered a couple of decades.

Are you not in the ministry anymore?

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by tv1a

If Paul can quote pagan poets in his writings and his sermons, pelathais can cite a dysfunctional athiest. Biblical prinicple already established. No way around it. Someone quoted Bob Dylan (the singer, not the poster) in another post.

Titus 1:12 - Paul in fact quotes a hymn to the god Zeus. The Cretians had built a tomb for their version of Zeus which greatly offended the Hellenes.

Paul quotes this same hymn in Acts 17:28 and attributes the praise to Zeus to Jesus Christ.

[RevDWW]

Originally Posted by tv1a

If Paul can quote pagan poets in his writings and his sermons, pelathais can cite a dysfunctional athiest. Biblical prinicple already established. No way around it. Someone quoted Bob Dylan (the singer, not the poster) in another post.

Did I say he couldn't or shouldn't? I'm not the AFF police.....

I just find it humorous that someone would use info against the church from such a biased source.

Bob Dylan was not an atheist at the time of his writing that song, thought he might be dysfunctional.......we still all gotta serve somebody.....

[RevDWW]

Originally Posted by pelathais

I wouldn't call her "dysfunctional" nor an "atheist." I've only spoken to her over the phone but I've read a couple of her books. In my current line of work I provide technical support to academics at times. I've been doing this for just a few years.

My views of "the Church," or "the Apostolic movement" is based upon a life long association and full time work within the ministry that covered a couple of decades.

AAI PRESS RELEASE: January, 15 2004
[for immediate distribution as news report, letter or commentary]


Ann Druyan Joins Stars of Freethought
to Focus on the Real Family


Author-producer Ann Druyan will receive the prestigious Richard Dawkins award as one of the world's outstanding atheists at the AAI convention, April 9-11 in Colorado Springs.

http://www.atheistalliance.org/library/news_011504.php
But maybe she has changed since 2004.......