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Originally Posted by mizpeh
You have conflicting statements in this paragraph.
1) Jesus is God as per His person
2) Human nature alone died.
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I see no conflict.
"Jesus is God as per His person", means that the PERSON who is both God and Man was Who it was Who died. There is only one PERSON in the Godhead. The Father is not the Son, but the Person of the Father is the Person of the Son.
Let me use a crude example to show my point. If I was God, I could do many things, and do them all at once, and remain one person. If I turned myself into a table and at the same time I turned myself into a chair, but in no way limited myself to ONLY BEING a table and a chair, that would be two manifestations. We know a table is not a chair. But the ONE WHO BECAME a table and a chair is the same person. Similarly, GOD's single person was both Father and Son at the same time. But a Father is not a Son. They are two different manifestations.
So, when I said "Jesus is God as per His person", I meant the PERSON of Jesus is no other person aside from the person of God. That ONE PERSON Who is God was the Son of God as well as Father. But the Father did not die. The Father is DEITY ALONE. The Son is not. He is both deity and humanity. But when the Son died, the deity did not die. Only the humanity.
Although we cannot say GOD DIED, we know that THE PERSON of the Son that died was the same person Who is ALSO GOD. He was both man and God at one time. Jesus is the PERSON'S NAME, not just the Son's name. And when I say "Jesus is God as per His person", and then say "Human nature alone died." there is no conflict. One has to realize that the PERSON is common, but not the manifestation of that person. that SINGLE person of God was both human and divine. And only the HUMAN ASPECT of Him died.
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So what you are saying, imo, is that human nature consists of a human spirit/soul and a human body. And when Jesus died, the human died since Jesus is God and God did not die and God was not human. Therefore Jesus, the Son of God, could not possibly be God.
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No, that is not what I said. Read over my explanation above carefully, and I trust you will see that now.
No offence intended to anyone, but this is all really Oneness 101. I am just surprised many people disagree who call themselves oneness. Really, I mean absolutely no offence. It just raises my eyebrows a bit.
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Or you may be saying that when Jesus died, the person of Jesus who is God, left the human nature alone to die.
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No. Let me say it this way. The Person was manifest as both a human being and the Only Deity who ever existed, at the same time since the incarnation. That PERSON'S HUMANITY died, not His deity.
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Therefore you have two centers of consciousness within Christ, one who is God and the other who is human. And it was the human who said, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?"
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There were two centres of consciousness, or else Jesus could not speak of His will as well as "My God's" will. But that is only because there were two natures. Human and divine.
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but the writer of Hebrews lets us know that Christ is God: Heb 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever:
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Exactly. The SON IS BOTH God and man. THE FATHER IS ONLY GOD. The MAN aspect of he SON DIED, but all the while the SON AND THE FATHER are the same PERSON.
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The NAV translates John 1:14 as the "Word became flesh". We know from John 1:1 that the Word is God. So God became flesh.
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Only in the sense of being made flesh because HE INDWELT flesh, as the word DWELLED means.
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We could also say God became man since that is what is meant by flesh. I understand that God is immutable and cannot change who and what He is. Yet, not me, but the word of God states that God became a man.
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No it does not. It qualifies that, again, by saying HE DWELLED/TENTED with us.
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If you want to say that God tabernacled among us to try to turn the incarnation more into an indwelling, then wouldn't that be equivalent to saying that we as humans likewise tabernacle in this world?
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No. I am not trying to say anything. I am repeating what
John 1:14 said and what DWELLED means. I did not choose that meaning of DWELLED. That is the meaning.
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2 Cor 5:1-11? How is our "tabernacling" any different from Christ's "tabernacling"?
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We ARE human beings alone. Jesus is not. He existed as a PERSON (as the ONLY person of God) long before His SONSHIP existed.
That is how we are different.
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