Random Questions Thread

[Amanah]

Originally Posted by shag

Sister Alvear, were you insinuating that I do not have common sense, or did I misunderstand your insinuation? - as it relates to the last few posts of this thread.

Please explain and tell me I’ve misunderstood your intention, and who the “some” is that you are referring to.

Sister Alvear is commenting on one of the posts I made earlier in the thread about modesty. Sis Alvear is the embodiment of kindness.

[shag]

Originally Posted by Amanah

If you had to take a guess how would you explain it?

I’m trying to learn, my intent is not to lock up with anyone.
I attend a church that teaches dispensationalism theology (with futurist eschatology), so my goal from the beginning was to try to find out after recently hearing Matthew 13, if it conflicts with the teaching they(“futurist disp’s”) have of the rapture in first Corinthians 15. I’m not sure how they worked out, but that was my point from the beginning and asking on here, to see if someone understood that view,(between Matt. 13:30….and 1 Cor. 15)


The Parable of the Weeds Explained

Matt. 13:36 Then he left the crowd and went into the house. His disciples came to him and said, “Explain to us the parable of the weeds in the field.”

37 He answered, “The one who sowed the good seed is the Son of Man. 38 The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the people of the kingdom. The weeds are the people of the evil one, 39 and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels.

40 “As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. 41 The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. 42 They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 43 Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Whoever has ears, let them hear.


It would seem that whenever this were to take place, the evil people are taken out of the way, and the good people are left, or remain.


Similar to Matthew 24, where just as the “bad people” in the flood were removed, and Noah and his family remained, so also
37As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left.


Do you see the Matt. 24 above as future?
3 verses prior it mentions: 34Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

[shag]

Originally Posted by Amanah

Sister Alvear is commenting on one of the posts I made earlier in the thread about modesty. Sis Alvear is the embodiment of kindness.

Glad to hear, I did not think that was like her.

[Amanah]

Shag, the Apostle Paul took pleasure in insult because the more our flesh is weakened (humbled as in humility) the more we are useful to the Spirit. So, don't worry about offences. But, Sis Alvear was not being offensive.

2 Corinthians 12:9-10
King James Version
9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
10 Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.

[Amanah]

This might be correct, if not Esaias can fix it

Here's a summary of Matthew 24:

Matthew 24 can be divided into two main sections:

Section 1: Destruction of Jerusalem (70 AD)

- Jesus predicts the destruction of the Temple and Jerusalem (24:1-2)
- Disciples ask when it will happen and what signs will precede it (24:3)
- Jesus warns of false messiahs, wars, famines, and earthquakes (24:4-8)
- He describes the persecution of believers and the desecration of the Temple (24:9-15)
- He warns of the "abomination of desolation" (24:15-22)
- He prophesies the destruction of Jerusalem and the scattering of the Jews (24:23-28)

Section 2: Second Coming

- Jesus shifts focus to His Second Coming (24:29-31)
- He describes the signs preceding His return: celestial disturbances, tribulation, and the rise of false prophets (24:29-31)
- He emphasizes the need for readiness and watchfulness (24:32-35)
- He teaches the parable of the fig tree, illustrating the nearness of His return (24:32-35)
- He concludes with a call to be prepared, as the Son of Man will come at an unexpected hour (24:36-51)

In summary, the first part of Matthew 24 (1-28) concerns the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD, while the latter part (29-51) focuses on the Second Coming of Jesus Christ.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Amanah

Section 2: Second Coming

- Jesus shifts focus to His Second Coming (24:29-31)
- He describes the signs preceding His return: celestial disturbances, tribulation, and the rise of false prophets (24:29-31)
- He emphasizes the need for readiness and watchfulness (24:32-35)
- He teaches the parable of the fig tree, illustrating the nearness of His return (24:32-35)
- He concludes with a call to be prepared, as the Son of Man will come at an unexpected hour (24:36-51)

Matthew 24:29-32 KJV
Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: [30] And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. [31] And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

This is a statement about what would be happening "after the tribulation of those days", that is, after the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple. The cosmic disturbances are standard prophetic language referring to the overturning of secular and religious power structures (namely, the overthrow of the priestly and Pharisaic power over the people of God). The "sign of the Son of Man coming in the clouds with power and great glory" is a direct reference to the vision in Daniel 7 of the Son of Man coming in the clouds TO THE ANCIENT OF DAYS:

Daniel 7:13-14 KJV
I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. [14] And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

The vision in Daniel is explained thus:

Daniel 7:16-18 KJV
I came near unto one of them that stood by, and asked him the truth of all this. So he told me, and made me know the interpretation of the things. [17] These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth. [18] But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.

In the vision, one like the Son of Man takes dominion. In the explanation, the saints of the Most High take dominion. See here also:

Daniel 7:19-22 KJV
Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet; [20] And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows. [21] I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them; [22] Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

And here:

Daniel 7:26-27 KJV
But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. [27] And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

The vision of the Son of Man coming in the clouds with power and glory to the Ancient of Days is interpreted by the angel as the victory of the saints of God against the antichristian powers of the world.

Jesus often referred to Himself as "the Son of Man" and in fact told the priests that they were in fact witnessing - at the time of His arrest and trial - the coming of the Son of Man in the clouds with power and glory:

Matthew 26:62-64 KJV
And the high priest arose, and said unto him, Answerest thou nothing? what is it which these witness against thee? [63] But Jesus held his peace. And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God. [64] Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.

The word "hereafter" means literally "from now on", from this current point in time going forward into the future. They, the priests, would at that time begin to see the Son of Man sitting on the right hand of God and coming in the clouds of Heaven.

Jesus, dying, and resurrecting, IS the victory of the saints over all enemies. His suffering, death, resurrection, and ascension, was His being presented before the Ancient of Days as the Messiah, and the Lamb of God, and the victorious Anointed One. His death, resurrection, and ascension is the Christological fulfillment of the vision in Daniel chapter 7. It is through His death and His triumph over death that the saints are able to enter the Kingdom and achieve victory. "This is the victory that overcomes the world, even our faith".

While the ultimate fulfillment of the saints victory is consummated in the final judgment and the destruction of death itself, we have the victory NOW because Christ is the archetypal Israel. It is only by being in Christ that we can lay any claim to being part of Israel.

So "seeing the sign of the Son of Man coming in the clouds" etc is referencing the nations being made aware that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, the victorious one seen in Daniel 7, the fulfillment of prophecy, the Messiah. They would see THE SIGN "of the Son of Man in Heaven coming in the clouds", that is, they would see Daniel 7's fulfillment. He is not talking about people seeing a Jesus-figure in the literal skies.

After the destruction of Jerusalem, the Jewish power was negated, the nations saw the sign that Jesus is the Christ, and His messengers went forth with the Gospel to gather the elect from the four directions. Basically, just like He said. Futurists confound this part of the Olivet prophecy with the return of Jesus and the resurrection of the saints. This is largely due to their unfamiliarity with Bible prophecy in general and prophetic language in particular.


Verses 36-51 are speaking of the return of Jesus. Notice, there is a difference between "the coming of the Son of Man", and the "return" of the Lord, in this prophecy and throughout the teachings of Jesus. The coming of the Lord in judgment upon Jerusalem was clearly taught by Him numerous times, and it was attended with signs that would warn of its impending occurrence. The RETURN of the Lord to resurrect the saints is always spoken of as being sudden and unexpected, with no prior attending warning signs.

[Esaias]

Matthew 22:1-14 KJV
And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said, [2] The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son, [3] And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come. [4] Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage. [5] But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise: [6] And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them. [7] But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city. [8] Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy. [9] Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage. [10] So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests. [11] And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment: [12] And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless. [13] Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. [14] For many are called, but few are chosen.

The invitation is given, it is rejected, the Lord then destroys the city of the rejectors. AFTER THAT, the invitation is extended to others, and the wedding is furnished with guests, UNTIL the arrival of the king to inspect them, at which time there is a separation and judgment upon those not properly prepared.

There is the coming of the Lord in judgment upon Jerusalem, and then there is the arrival and appearance of the Lord to cleanse His Kingdom and give reward to His servants.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by shag

Thank you

Yet another q…

From a futurist perspective, how do they reconcile ...

I don't know how futurists reconcile anything.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Amanah

I don't do dispensationalism.

[Amanah]

Thank you Elder.
Your explanation makes sense because:
1. the parable of the fig tree, and
2. the statement of this generation not passing away Were definitely out of place

And I was uncomfortable about it, but just couldn't figure it out.