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  #31  
Old 02-06-2012, 02:44 AM
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Re: Rejoicing In the Sabbath:

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Originally Posted by Jay View Post
The Sabbath was a Jewish cultural observance mandated by God. Paul never instructs the Gentiles into the exactitude that was required of the Jewish people. That is why he mentions it the way that he does in any number of places. The reason that he continued to follow the Jewish tradition was because he was Jewish.
Paul also did jewish vows even had tim cricumcised. Why? To win them. Same thing with sabbath.
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  #32  
Old 02-06-2012, 02:59 AM
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Re: Rejoicing In the Sabbath:

Only in part. Paul was actually content with his heritage, and even referenced in the epistles to the Gentiles, especially when he tells them that they are not under any portion of the law.

I do agree that men ought to have a day of rest, but even Jesus said that the Sabbath was ordained for man and not the other way around. Thus I do not view that the Sabbath according to Scripture was ever meant to remain as a permanent ordinance especially for the Gentile church. This is especially true concerning the strict adherence that many who believe this place upon it.
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  #33  
Old 02-06-2012, 07:30 AM
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Re: Rejoicing In the Sabbath:

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Originally Posted by Titus2woman View Post
I just have to ask MTD... why would you need proof that humans need a day of rest and worship? As once said by a famous person... "does not even nature teach it is so?" Even our human employers do not make us work 7 days a week recognizing our need for rest and renewal. There are many commandments that are sometimes tough to keep... why not take advantage of the one that is never hard to do
We do need time off. Most employers at least IN THEORY give two days off. As far as a DAY of worship? That I dont get. I worship Yeshua every day. We are to ABIDE IN CHRIST?

As far as not being hard to do I would say IF we were to COMMANDED to keep it that it would be THE HARDEST.

Since 1978 I have not had a job where I could chose to work or not work weekends. They would never hire people who told them they would not work weekends. Where I work now we work rotating days off. I get one weekend off per month.

By the way some in this thread have a very different version of the Sabbath. Friends the Sabbath Yeshua kept was SATURDAY. The seventh day of the week. Scripture knows NOTHING about the Sabbath being on Sunday.

If in fact we were under the Sabbath/Saturday law one would go to Hell if he did not obey. Most hard core Law Keepers teach this. The SDA says to go to Church on Sunday is the mark of the beast.

Last edited by Michael The Disciple; 02-06-2012 at 07:36 AM.
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  #34  
Old 02-06-2012, 07:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay
The Sabbath was a Jewish cultural observance mandated by God. Paul never instructs the Gentiles into the exactitude that was required of the Jewish people. That is why he mentions it the way that he does in any number of places. The reason that he continued to follow the Jewish tradition was because he was Jewish.
So the adultery clause was a Jewish cultural observance? Remember, the tabernacle, including the ark was modeled after pre-existent Heavenly realities. Even Heaven has an ark (Revelation 11:19). In it can be found the Ten Commandments. What does Revelation 14:12 say?

Revelation 14:12 ESV
Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.

Jesus said,

Matthew 5:19 ESV
Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Why are you at war with the Ten Commandments?
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  #35  
Old 02-06-2012, 07:52 AM
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If one studies this issue, they will realize that early Jews and Christians had no concept of Sunday as a day of worship. It wasn't until the Romanization of the church began did any controversy erupt. The Catholic church claimed authority to abolish the Sabbath and institute Sunday Mass. Their own theologians testify to this as a victory of the Catholic church's authority. They also admit that Protestants acknowledge their authority by Sunday worship because NOTHING in Scripture declares Sunday as a day of worship nor the abolishing of Sabbath observance.
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  #36  
Old 02-06-2012, 07:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

We do need time off. Most employers at least IN THEORY give two days off. As far as a DAY of worship? That I dont get. I worship Yeshua every day. We are to ABIDE IN CHRIST?

As far as not being hard to do I would say IF we were to COMMANDED to keep it that it would be THE HARDEST.

Since 1978 I have not had a job where I could chose to work or not work weekends. They would never hire people who told them they would not work weekends. Where I work now we work rotating days off. I get one weekend off per month.

By the way some in this thread have a very different version of the Sabbath. Friends the Sabbath Yeshua kept was SATURDAY. The seventh day of the week. Scripture knows NOTHING about the Sabbath being on Sunday.

If in fact we were under the Sabbath/Saturday law one would go to Hell if he did not obey. Most hard core Law Keepers teach this. The SDA says to go to Church on Sunday is the mark of the beast.
Many have their lives for Jesus. And you think finding a job where you have Saturdays off is too hard???

The Jews in exile were often challenged to keep God's commandments. God knows the intent of our hearts. If you must work, take time to rest and worship after work on the Sabbath.
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  #37  
Old 02-06-2012, 08:23 AM
Titus2woman Titus2woman is offline


 
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Re: Rejoicing In the Sabbath:

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Originally Posted by Jay View Post
Only in part. Paul was actually content with his heritage, and even referenced in the epistles to the Gentiles, especially when he tells them that they are not under any portion of the law.

I do agree that men ought to have a day of rest, but even Jesus said that the Sabbath was ordained for man and not the other way around. Thus I do not view that the Sabbath according to Scripture was ever meant to remain as a permanent ordinance especially for the Gentile church. This is especially true concerning the strict adherence that many who believe this place upon it.
The typical Sunday-worshiping argument. "We are not under any portion of the law." Yet we still do not kill, steal. covet.. oh wait... we do covet, don't we??? Perhaps you are correct!

I do not read that the Sabbath was ever changed for Christians who were first Jews or that a 'second Sabbath' was made for Gentile converts who continued to worship on the Sabbath for a few centuries. I do read that Sunday worship was preferred by Constantine who was a Sun god worshiper. He, in all likelihood, was never even really converted as evidenced by his refusal for baptism until his death bed. He was simply a politician that saw it as a good career move to claim Christianity as his religion to smooth his path with what was becoming the majority. Many do this today also so it should be a concept we understand.

There are many other facts that OPs recognize from this era if one reads D. Bernard's History Of The Christian Church correctly. Unfortunately when they took back those truths about Jesus name baptism and God's Oneness they did not go far enough and take back the Sabbath, much to their detriment. Like most mistakes, once made, it is easier to try to justify than to correct them and admit you were wrong. A few brave churches are doing just that but unraveling tradition can be a mighty hard thing and I am sympathetic to those who find it too big a job.

I see over and over that Christians are told that they are allowed many liberties, Many places that the Bible, when it appears to contradict, is simply saying let common sense rule in a situation and don't judge your brother when he is doing the best he can with what he has. I love that, it bring peace to me when others don't see it my way.

I believe that where there is a choice we should try to honor God in the ways that he has ordained and that the bible was given us so that we could know what those ways are. Trying to erase the old testaments moral laws and commandments is foolish. We were given the Holy Spirit in order to be able to find strength to keep those moral laws and when not able mercy is extended through repentance. I do not hear anyone trying to argue that we should attempt to keep ceremonial laws, although Oneness Pentecostalism does attempt to keep some of them, I certainly am not.

You are right the Sabbath is a gift from God to man. You do not have to take it. My favorite comparison is to the Holy Spirit which is also a gift from God. You can refuse it, many do, but is it to your benefit? When God gives gifts I want to be the first one in line with my hand out
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  #38  
Old 02-06-2012, 08:30 AM
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Re: Rejoicing In the Sabbath:

If we are going to keep one part of the law then we must keep all the law. BTW where do folkss get to divide the law into moral, ceremonial, etc...... Jesus and apostles only refered to the law.
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Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.


The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
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  #39  
Old 02-06-2012, 08:35 AM
Titus2woman Titus2woman is offline


 
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Re: Rejoicing In the Sabbath:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple View Post
We do need time off. Most employers at least IN THEORY give two days off. As far as a DAY of worship? That I dont get. I worship Yeshua every day. We are to ABIDE IN CHRIST?

As far as not being hard to do I would say IF we were to COMMANDED to keep it that it would be THE HARDEST.

Since 1978 I have not had a job where I could chose to work or not work weekends. They would never hire people who told them they would not work weekends. Where I work now we work rotating days off. I get one weekend off per month.

By the way some in this thread have a very different version of the Sabbath. Friends the Sabbath Yeshua kept was SATURDAY. The seventh day of the week. Scripture knows NOTHING about the Sabbath being on Sunday.

If in fact we were under the Sabbath/Saturday law one would go to Hell if he did not obey. Most hard core Law Keepers teach this. The SDA says to go to Church on Sunday is the mark of the beast.
MTD, I hope you did not mistake my quoting an old Baptist teaching on 'Sunday Sabbath' being agreement with it, which would be the opposite of my point. I disagree completely but wanted to point out that this was a typical reason that was cited in both Pentecostal and other churches for years for Sunday worship.

My husband works a 2nd shift 10X4 week that ends on Friday. He is typically at work until 1 am or so Saturday. He begins Sabbath rest when he is finished with work Saturday morning rather than Friday at sundown. We trust mercy for that as we do for each way we fail God. He knows and will in time provide us a way to honor Sabbath more traditionally.
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  #40  
Old 02-06-2012, 08:39 AM
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Re: Rejoicing In the Sabbath:

Can't quote. Law to be obey then make allowance for not obeying it completely.
__________________
Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.


The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.

Last edited by Truthseeker; 02-06-2012 at 08:42 AM.
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