My friend, you seem to be a devout person who believes what they believe sincerely, and I can respect that. In fact, I'm actually quite impressed with you. You have demonstrated a measure of courage by joining in the discussions posted on this forum. Cheers to you.
However, let me be very clear about something. I didn't call you, or anybody else a fool. In reading this thread, you may have inferred a personal attack on your intelligence, (and you'd be wrong btw) but it still doesn't equate to being labeled a fool. Foolishness denotes lack of wisdom, not intelligence. (I've been accused of lacking both )
Now, what was the point of this thread anyway??
In some obscure, twisted way, I think the general message is actually a rather noble one. I'm simply challenging folks to think, independently! With a certain few, maybe that isn't a good thing, but it's generally a good rule of practice for the rest of us. Of course, the reality is, we all have our limitations (see original posts 1-2), and ultimately, our worth as an individual is not really contingent on whether we're a brainiac or not. If you feel differently, then I'm obliged to respectfully disagree.
If you hang around, I think you''ll develop an appreciation for a lot of the good folks that make AFF great. Don't know what you've been told, but there exists a great wealth of knowledge, wisdom and faith among its members (typing from the bottom of the totem pole here). I don't know of any formal rules, but I suspect that original, well thought out contributions are respected by everybody that reads here. I certainly welcome them. Most of us can sniff up posts that smell of organizational propaganda before you click on the submit button. Unscrupulous and dubious doctrines do not go unchallenged in this realm, (if we have time to log on of course).
Bottom line: We want you to win. Period.
Here's something to consider. Ask your pastor (assuming you have one) for a list of criteria which helps him to determine "outward holiness standards" in his congregation, (again, assuming he holds them). Before he goes off prooftexting a bunch of gobbly gook, stop him in his tracks and respectfully ask "Wasn't the earthly Jesus Christ our standard? If he insists on adding to the "inadequacy" of the proposal by undermining the work of the Spirit in our complex lives, it may be the impetus you need to write a book on, "Christian Standards That Eclipse Jesus Christ," which is no doubt destined to become a best seller. Just cut me a little of the top for the idea.
My friend, you seem to be a devout person who believes what they believe sincerely, and I can respect that. In fact, I'm actually quite impressed with you. You have demonstrated a measure of courage by joining in the discussions posted on this forum. Cheers to you.
However, let me be very clear about something. I didn't call you, or anybody else a fool. In reading this thread, you may have inferred a personal attack on your intelligence, (and you'd be wrong btw) but it still doesn't equate to being labeled a fool. Foolishness denotes lack of wisdom, not intelligence. (I've been accused of lacking both )
Now, what was the point of this thread anyway??
In some obscure, twisted way, I think the general message is actually a rather noble one. I'm simply challenging folks to think, independently! With a certain few, maybe that isn't a good thing, but it's generally a good rule of practice for the rest of us. Of course, the reality is, we all have our limitations (see original posts 1-2), and ultimately, our worth as an individual is not really contingent on whether we're a brainiac or not. If you feel differently, then I'm obliged to respectfully disagree.
If you hang around, I think you''ll develop an appreciation for a lot of the good folks that make AFF great. Don't know what you've been told, but there exists a great wealth of knowledge, wisdom and faith among its members (typing from the bottom of the totem pole here). I don't know of any formal rules, but I suspect that original, well thought out contributions are respected by everybody that reads here. I certainly welcome them. Most of us can sniff up posts that smell of organizational propaganda before you click on the submit button. Unscrupulous and dubious doctrines do not go unchallenged in this realm, (if we have time to log on of course).
Bottom line: We want you to win. Period.
Here's something to consider. Ask your pastor (assuming you have one) for a list of criteria which helps him to determine "outward holiness standards" in his congregation, (again, assuming he holds them). Before he goes off prooftexting a bunch of gobbly gook, stop him in his tracks and respectfully ask "Wasn't the earthly Jesus Christ our standard? If he insists on adding to the "inadequacy" of the proposal by undermining the work of the Spirit in our complex lives, it may be the impetus you need to write a book on, "Christian Standards That Eclipse Jesus Christ," which is no doubt destined to become a best seller. Just cut me a little of the top for the idea.
Sorry that I haven't responded before now. I will go ahead and take you at your word, but please consider your phrasing on future posts. Review my earlier post on this thread where I pointed out what was offensive. I don't hate you, but I don't like to be insulted. Whatever your intention, all is forgiven..
Sorry that I haven't responded before now. I will go ahead and take you at your word, but please consider your phrasing on future posts. Review my earlier post on this thread where I pointed out what was offensive. I don't hate you, but I don't like to be insulted. Whatever your intention, all is forgiven..
Okay, if you continue to insult me, I will just find another forum. This is really childish. I am happy to debate with you, but stop calling me stupid.
I took offense because of the following:
1. The title was "Intelligence Is Still Important" and then the beginning of the post, "In response to recent postings from our dogmatic hardliner friends."
2. The highlighted statement, "Morality is conventional, a matter of serving the social order and tradition or doing your duty as defined by some authority like the church, a teacher, a parent or the state. This large group is the glue of society but given the wrong authority it (and the two groups below it) may do horrible things in the name of morality."
3. The quote from Mark Twain and the last comment. ""In religion and politics people's beliefs and convictions are in almost every case gotten at second-hand, and without examination, from authorities who have not themselves examined the questions at issue but have taken them at second-hand from other non-examiners, whose opinions about them were not worth a brass farthing.
I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's...
He is the only animal that loves his neighbor as himself and cuts his throat if his theology isn't straight. He has made a graveyard of the globe in trying his honest best to smooth his brother's path to happiness and heaven...."
-Mark Twain-
"Nothing new under the sun, eh Mr. Twain?"
I'm not as stupid as you might think. You don't even know me, so how can you assume stupidity is the reason for my beliefs? You didn't even pay any attention to the list of names either. I am willing to bet that each of the men on my list are MUCH smarter than you. Quit resulting to childish accusations and let your scripture knowledge speak for itself. Oh wait a minute, you haven't posted any scripture. BTW, I didn't get what I believe from my pastor. I stand for many things that he doesn't stand for. Get your facts straight.
Ummmm was this in response to my very short paragraph or are lessons in quoting the person you are responding to necessary?
__________________
"Beware lest you lose the substance by grasping at the shadow." ~Aesop
Sorry that I haven't responded before now. I will go ahead and take you at your word, but please consider your phrasing on future posts. Review my earlier post on this thread where I pointed out what was offensive. I don't hate you, but I don't like to be insulted. Whatever your intention, all is forgiven..
I’m delighted that you are able to “forgive” me of my “trespass”, although, as stated earlier, I never singled you out for a personal attack in the first place. Instead of believing that this thread was some kind of underhanded maneuver to attack you personally, why don’t you consider it for what it really is? A. My creative attempt at presenting a human psychological/social phenomenon in the big picture-aerial view format. B. A rebuttal to erroneous, chronically appearing doctrines which purport themselves to be moral law, but in actuality, oppose the fundamental tenets of Christian truths and sound reasoning. So, excluding an endorsement for the quantification of intelligence, I stand by everything that I’ve posted in this thread, and unashamedly so. I have reviewed your claims of damage, and, although I find them unfounded, am glad to be standing in your good favor again, whoever you are.
Quote:
If creating a thread entitled "Intelligence Is Still Important" is calling you stupid, then is creating a thread entitled "Holiness Is Still Important" calling him unholy?
If you would consider Timmy’s quote above, (and I must say, it’s a classic) then you must realize that your implications cut both ways. By claiming me to be an insulting bully on the basis of my thread title, you are, in fact, calling out everyone on this forum who rejects your view of holiness as being unholy and unfit for God’s kingdom. How so? Because you assume the position of attaching holiness to church membership rules (possibly indoctrinated into you by other men) which, at minimum, carries a tendency to reduce all other believers outside of certain doctrinaire circles to sinner-slum-Christian-wannabes who can’t quite hack it with the big boys. For starters, let us briefly examine one of the many assertions that you’ve made on AFF recently.
Quote:
Television was preached against in the 60s. How much more so should we preach against it today?... Television…cannot be controlled. [FFWD] I wouldn't want to stand in the shoes of a compromiser on the Day of Judgment.
These are your statements above from your thread, “Holiness Is Still Important.” It seems quite clear to me that you are calling your brethren “compromisers” (of truth) if they choose to own or watch t.v., but please, correct me if I’m wrong. If you do stand by the above, then I must let you in a little secret. Asceticism and personal consecrations do have the ability to enhance your life, but defrauding and dividing your brethren by attempting to umpire their spirituality is flat out despicable imo. I would hope the men you mentioned in previous posts do not promote half of what you asserted in your thread, but if they do, I could tell you that their positions would be eaten alive in a classroom of college undergrads, much like a piranha shredding a sick cow in deep water. Believe me, I’ve played that side of the board with black, and it’s checkmate before you get out of the opening. Anyhow, welcome to AFF, and welcome to “growing pains.”
Last edited by noeticknight; 05-27-2010 at 04:50 PM.
the thread is mocking a thread on holiness standards....no matter how many words you use denying.....and the ones being called stupid had their replies quoted....no matter how the poster attempts to deny...
I understand the implications and I find them distasteful. BTW, I work a very complex job. If you're trying to make fun of my recent post, then have at it. People made fun of Noah too. Oh yes, and would you describe the following men as ignorant?
Tamalge French
Larry Booker
Wayne McClain
David Bernard
Paul Mooney
These men hold the same views that I do. I guess that makes them stupid and immoral men. God have mercy on you.
Aren't you jumping to conclusions here, PF? Sir Noe Tick didn't cast aspersions on anyone. He was merely responding to to complaints like: "Their (AFF's) intellectual approach to everything has caused them to be reprobate concerning the faith."
The remarks about the various "IQ levels" would seem to indicate that the higher you go "intellectually" the more isolated you may become socially. Perhaps that is why some will decry an "intellectual approach" to matters of philosophy and belief as being "reprobate."
and yall wonder why all the conservative people leave....if you enjoy debate so much why not debate the thread instead of starting a mocking one?
I guess I missed something as well. What thread did Noe duck out of in order to start this "mocking thread?"
I just took the whole thing to be his usual thoughtful ruminations and as a sort of request for comment. Just because he posted something about "IQs" doesn't mean he suspects or even could know just exactly how you or anyone else scores.
Don't be intimidated by the subject matter and as a result attack the poster. Either engage the topic or ignore it. It's your choice.
And FWIW - I met Sir Noe Tick by arguing with him. I've forgotten exactly what we quarreled about, but he earned my respect; not always my agreement - but my respect.
)
These are your statements above from your thread, “Holiness Is Still Important.” It seems quite clear to me that you are calling your brethren “compromisers” (of truth) if they choose to own or watch t.v., but please, correct me if I’m wrong. If you do stand by the above, then I must let you in a little secret. Asceticism and personal consecrations do have the ability to enhance your life, but defrauding and dividing your brethren by attempting to umpire their spirituality is flat out despicable imo. I would hope the men you mentioned in previous posts do not promote half of what you asserted in your thread, but if they do, I could tell you that their positions would be eaten alive in a classroom of college undergrads, much like a piranha shredding a sick cow in deep water. Believe me, I’ve played that side of the board with black, and it’s checkmate before you get out of the opening. Anyhow, welcome to AFF, and welcome to “growing pains.”
Linear Mode
