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  #31  
Old 04-18-2008, 01:12 PM
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Re: The Truest Signs of an Immature Christian

1. Uses a musical instrument as part of their forum identity
2. Admits to befriending and breaking bread with CC1.
3. Uses his available free days to golf
4. Follows sports too closely! (Especially football and baseball)
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  #32  
Old 04-18-2008, 01:14 PM
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Re: The Truest Signs of an Immature Christian

Maturity is in reach of every disciple however it takes a process of time.
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  #33  
Old 04-18-2008, 01:25 PM
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Re: The Truest Signs of an Immature Christian

Quote:
Originally Posted by cneasttx View Post
Oh, that was one of my faults Prax. That is what I think keeps people sitting on the pew and not going and doing what we are commanded to do. I am in my 50's and just now learning I was selfish about the gospel. Not that I always have been but lately that seems to be how I seem to myself.
Let me elaborate too. BTW I think everyone should study Love. Love is not selfish. Read 1Cor. It's really amazing. Selfish people talk more about themselves. Selfish people only go to church for themselves. They only pray for themselves. Their walk...their efforts to live for God...are for themselves. They preach to be heard and seen. The focus is always on them. Selfishness does not necessarily mean being introverted or shy. It's one thing to have a hard time talking to strangers about the gospel. But another when your motives for doing anything is about yourself or for NOT doing anything is because you don't care about others.

Why go to church?
Why pray?
Why have a relationship with Jesus?
Why teach Sunday School?
What is our motive?

The Corinthians were selfish. I've been on Corinthians for a couple weeks now. It started by reading Paul talk about Israel in the wilderness and how their fall was for our example. They were impatient. They were not thankful for what God already gave them. They were not satisfied with the manna.

1Co 10:1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
1Co 10:2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
1Co 10:3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
1Co 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
1Co 10:5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.
1Co 10:6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.
1Co 10:7 Neither be ye idolaters, as were some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.
1Co 10:8 Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand.
1Co 10:9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.
1Co 10:10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.
1Co 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for examples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

Here is the kicker. If we look at the types here, this is a church that was taken OUT of sin (egypt) and even baptized (red sea) and yet could not enter the promised land due to unbelief

This next part I just read again recently. Love or Charity is supposed to be our reason for everything. Jesus said IF you love me keep my commandments...not "If you want to escape hell keep my commandments"...the greatest command is Love...and love is what?

1Co 13:1 If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal.
1Co 13:2 And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.
1Co 13:3 If I give away all I have, and if I deliver up my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing.
1Co 13:4 Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant
1Co 13:5 or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful;
1Co 13:6 it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth.
1Co 13:7 Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
1Co 13:8 Love never ends. As for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away.
1Co 13:9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part,
1Co 13:10 but when the perfect comes, the partial will pass away.
1Co 13:11 When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I gave up childish ways.
1Co 13:12 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I have been fully known.
1Co 13:13 So now faith, hope, and love abide, these three; but the greatest of these is love.

You can speak in tongues, prophesy and understand all mysteries and still not have love. You can give to the Poor and still not have love.

Love is
Patient
Kind
Does not envy or boats
Is not arrogant or rude
Does not insist on it's own way (wow)
is not irritable or resentful

Then Paul relates this to being a child. He accused the Corinthians of being spiritually immature and carnal, even though he admitted they had tongues and prophesy and the gifts etc etc. It is said that the Corinthians thought they were spiritual superior because they had the gifts operating but Paul said they were really carnal and immature. They had faith, but not love....
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Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:


  1. There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
  2. The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
  3. Every sinner must repent of their sins.
  4. That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
  5. That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
  6. The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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  #34  
Old 04-18-2008, 01:32 PM
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Cindy Cindy is offline
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Re: The Truest Signs of an Immature Christian

Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas View Post
Let me elaborate too. BTW I think everyone should study Love. Love is not selfish. Read 1Cor. It's really amazing. Selfish people talk more about themselves. Selfish people only go to church for themselves. They only pray for themselves. Their walk...their efforts to live for God...are for themselves. They preach to be heard and seen. The focus is always on them. Selfishness does not necessarily mean being introverted or shy. It's one thing to have a hard time talking to strangers about the gospel. But another when your motives for doing anything is about yourself or for NOT doing anything is because you don't care about others.

Why go to church?
Why pray?
Why have a relationship with Jesus?
Why teach Sunday School?
What is our motive?

The Corinthians were selfish. I've been on Corinthians for a couple weeks now. It started by reading Paul talk about Israel in the wilderness and how their fall was for our example. They were impatient. They were not thankful for what God already gave them. They were not satisfied with the manna.

1Co 10:1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
1Co 10:2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
1Co 10:3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
1Co 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
1Co 10:5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.
1Co 10:6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.
1Co 10:7 Neither be ye idolaters, as were some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.
1Co 10:8 Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand.
1Co 10:9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.
1Co 10:10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.
1Co 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for examples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

Here is the kicker. If we look at the types here, this is a church that was taken OUT of sin (egypt) and even baptized (red sea) and yet could not enter the promised land due to unbelief

This next part I just read again recently. Love or Charity is supposed to be our reason for everything. Jesus said IF you love me keep my commandments...not "If you want to escape hell keep my commandments"...the greatest command is Love...and love is what?

1Co 13:1 If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal.
1Co 13:2 And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.
1Co 13:3 If I give away all I have, and if I deliver up my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing.
1Co 13:4 Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant
1Co 13:5 or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful;
1Co 13:6 it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth.
1Co 13:7 Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
1Co 13:8 Love never ends. As for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away.
1Co 13:9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part,
1Co 13:10 but when the perfect comes, the partial will pass away.
1Co 13:11 When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I gave up childish ways.
1Co 13:12 For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I have been fully known.
1Co 13:13 So now faith, hope, and love abide, these three; but the greatest of these is love.

You can speak in tongues, prophesy and understand all mysteries and still not have love. You can give to the Poor and still not have love.

Love is
Patient
Kind
Does not envy or boats
Is not arrogant or rude
Does not insist on it's own way (wow)
is not irritable or resentful

Then Paul relates this to being a child. He accused the Corinthians of being spiritually immature and carnal, even though he admitted they had tongues and prophesy and the gifts etc etc. It is said that the Corinthians thought they were spiritual superior because they had the gifts operating but Paul said they were really carnal and immature. They had faith, but not love....
Yes, that is what I was talking about. I have prayed for God to give me this, His kind of love for others and not just worry about myself. But my heart and spirit have to be clean and right before I can do this.
__________________
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV

He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV

Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
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  #35  
Old 04-18-2008, 01:47 PM
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Praxeas Praxeas is offline
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Re: The Truest Signs of an Immature Christian

Quote:
Originally Posted by cneasttx View Post
Yes, that is what I was talking about. I have prayed for God to give me this, His kind of love for others and not just worry about myself. But my heart and spirit have to be clean and right before I can do this.
Only God can make a heart clean and pure. Our job is to trust in Him. Lean not to our own understanding but to just look to him.
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:


  1. There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
  2. The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
  3. Every sinner must repent of their sins.
  4. That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
  5. That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
  6. The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 04-18-2008, 01:59 PM
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Re: The Truest Signs of an Immature Christian

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pastor Poster View Post
I believe the truest signs of an immature Christian are:

1. A lack of balance
2. Extremism
3. Judgementalism.

I worry about folks who change their beliefs as often as their undies.
Man, I really pity people who change their undies as often as someone who changes their belief as often as someone who is grounded in their faith!!
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  #37  
Old 04-18-2008, 02:46 PM
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TRFrance TRFrance is offline
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Re: The Truest Signs of an Immature Christian

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pastor Poster View Post
I believe the truest signs of an immature Christian are:

1. A lack of balance
2. Extremism
3. Judgementalism.

I worry about folks who change their beliefs as often as their undies.

I worry about folks who are extreme right and extreme left.

I do think we should all have a firm set of principles we live by. I can't imagine what life would be like without a firm set of core beliefs.
Indeed. I also have an issue with folks who have no problem casually skipping church services, bible studies, Sunday Schoool etc. A disciplined Christian understands the importance of being in the Lord's house when he/she's supposed to be.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pastor Poster View Post
Pianoman, I agree in principle. But I have seen folks who never develop core beliefs because they are in love with questioning. They enjoy the questions more than the answers. They can never find truth because they have no guiderails to point the way to it.

That is a miserable existence.
True. Some believers seem to think that to avoid core beliefs is a virtuous thing, since in their minds it means they're being "open minded" and "non-judgmental".
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  #38  
Old 04-18-2008, 03:01 PM
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Re: The Truest Signs of an Immature Christian

Quote:
Originally Posted by TRFrance View Post
Indeed. I also have an issue with folks who have no problem casually skipping church services, bible studies, Sunday Schoool etc. A disciplined Christian understands the importance of being in the Lord's house when he/she's supposed to be.
TRF,
If the former tabernacle was a building, and the new tabernacle is a body, what are you presenting as the Lord's house?
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  #39  
Old 04-18-2008, 03:06 PM
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Re: The Truest Signs of an Immature Christian

Also...

Immaturity involves extreme emotions from circumstances... like flying off the handle in rage, and jumping from extreme joy to extreme depression.
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  #40  
Old 04-18-2008, 03:11 PM
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Michael Phelps Michael Phelps is offline
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Re: The Truest Signs of an Immature Christian

Quote:
Originally Posted by Digging4Truth View Post
Thank you ma'am.

It looks like we are getting quite a few pointers on how to locate the immature Christian.

Once we get all of this information compiled we can start a thread on what to do once an immature Christian has been located.
I"m all in favor of tar and feathering them!
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