Uncut Hair

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

What does this say? What language is it?

Spanish


"On the contrary, the woman is allowed to grow her hair; because instead of veil is given the hair."

[houston]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Bro, please and also Michael. You must get restful sleep. Caffeine has a half life 5 to 6 hours. Meaning that it is ONLY to be consumed in the morning. The later you drink it, the harder it is to get rest. No "restful" sleep will pretty much kill you. What happens first is plummeting testosterone. Now, this is super dangerous. You as a male need your T levels at their optimum, and it is no joke. Hormonal imbalances can cause all sorts of issues, which show up first emotionally. Also with falling T levels you have rising cortisol levels, which not only destroy T levels, but attack brain function, joints, ligament, muscle tissue, blood circulation, motivation. Being unmotivated and being tired, doesn't mean we will achieve "restful" deep sleep. I believe Chris even posted how the screen electronics can jam up our sleep by actually keeping us awake. Also where we sleep is another factor, and a mattress which is perfect for us is important. Also pillow, also if we snore or if we stop breathing during our sleep that our body has to constantly wake us up or we suffocate. Anyway, with all that being said first, watch the caffeine (in all forms) intake.

I’ve been working over night since 2015. The first year I got maybe 3-4 hours of sleep on most days. The second year I was burnt and I began to sleep good. I’m programmed to sleep during the day And be up all night. But sometimes I can’t sleep during the day so I’m up 24-36 hours at a time.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I was discussing this point with a friend the other day. If this is the case, I think the discussion should surround that issue.

I can see the issue needing to be addressed with the Messianic/Hebrew Roots crowd that has men wearing Talits while reading Scripture, etc., in church. But among us Gentiles, in our Gentile churches, it isn't a real issue.

What's your angle? I'm curious.

But, the issue is about hair because the text says that it is. Perhaps, if we honestly get the head right, the rest falls into place. I say, honestly, because then we can't drag in the broadbrush of those who don't get it right.

Paul opens with this statement:

I Corinthians 11:3-6 (ESV)
3 But there is one thing I want you to know: The head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man, and the head of Christ is God. 4 A man dishonors his head (Christ) if he covers his head while praying or prophesying. 5 But a woman dishonors her head (her husband) if she prays or prophesies without a covering on her head, for this is the same as shaving her head. 6 Yes, if she refuses to wear a head covering, she should cut off all her hair! (like a prostitute) But since it is shameful for a woman to have her hair cut or her head shaved, she should wear a covering.

Paul's opening statement on the issue is why I believe that the issue was about headship and how women were dishonoring their husbands by not wearing their head coverings. This was an immodest act, and so this is why it was the same as if she were shaven like a prostitute (an immodest and loose woman). Clearly the women were disregarding their husband's admonitions to be covered. For this reason, they were not only being immodest, but they were challenging the headship of their husbands. And so, Paul addresses both issues as they relate to one another.

The ladies were getting all excited and going too far in their Christian liberty.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister

Yes, I believe that the consensus would be that it is long. Which would be contrary to the verse that is quoted later . . .

1 Corinthians 11:16

14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?

It is pretty obvious that the long in long hair is going to be subjective, as it is for women. Long as compared to what?

What I would like to focus on is the word nature. To me nature is what happens if there is no outside interference. So what is nature teaching us?

This is the way I understand it. If we take a look around in any congregation, we will see many times more bald men than we will see bald women. It is indeed unusual to see a bald woman. A bald man? Not so much! So there's that.

The other verse I would like to look at is verse 16 . . .

16 But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

If any man be contentious . . . Is there any contentiousness from any man?
I think it is obvious that there is. Some are contending for long hair, some are contending for hair that is uncut, some are contending that it really doesn't matter that much. There is much contending on the subject of long hair for women! So we have qualified in the contention category.

So what does the remainder of the verse say? . . . we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

If there is contention, we have no such custom. It is not there. It is interesting that Paul refers to it as a custom and not a commandment as well.

That's my thoughts. As I have said earlier in the thread, my preference for my house is uncut hair for the ladies, however if you want to contend with me about it, I refuse to do so. According to the scripture.

I think Paul was saying that if any man seem to be contentious about these things, we have no such custom... meaning... we aren't contentious about modesty and a woman's place in God's order. The New Living Translation renders the verse as such:

1 Corinthians 11:16 New Living Translation (NLT)
16 But if anyone wants to argue about this, I simply say that we have no other custom than this, and neither do God’s other churches.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by houston

I’ve been working over night since 2015. The first year I got maybe 3-4 hours of sleep on most days. The second year I was burnt and I began to sleep good. I’m programmed to sleep during the day And be up all night. But sometimes I can’t sleep during the day so I’m up 24-36 hours at a time.

I started on 3rd shift in 2011. For a week I slept ok. Then it hit. I did probably average 5 hours sleep per day. I retired in January so Im back to regular 1st shift type hours. It has been very hard so far. I thought I would quickly adjust but its slow transitioning so far.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Spanish


"On the contrary, the woman is allowed to grow her hair; because instead of veil is given the hair."

But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering. 1 Cor 11:15

Well I checked my 8 version New Testament and not one version uses the phrase "instead of ".

Neither does any of them use "is allowed to grow her hair".

However if it did say she is allowed to grow her hair thats good. But it would certainly not mean she is never allowed to cut it. Just that she is allowed to grow it.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by houston

I’ve been working over night since 2015. The first year I got maybe 3-4 hours of sleep on most days. The second year I was burnt and I began to sleep good. I’m programmed to sleep during the day And be up all night. But sometimes I can’t sleep during the day so I’m up 24-36 hours at a time.

Bro, you have to sleep. You have to get good rest. I cannot stress this enough.
Because when we end up in the hospital we won't be working at the job. Then we have the hospital keeping us up.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering. 1 Cor 11:15

Well I checked my 8 version New Testament and not one version uses the phrase "instead of ".

Neither does any of them use "is allowed to grow her hair".

However if it did say she is allowed to grow her hair thats good. But it would certainly not mean she is never allowed to cut it. Just that she is allowed to grow it.

The Greek means flowing down so much as it becomes ornamental. The Vulgate understands the Greek in its purest form, to allow to raise to maturity. Just like the Italian and the Spanish. So, these Latin cultures had hundreds of years of women NOT cutting their hair because of their understanding of their scriptures. American Modernists on the other hand were taught in English, with a Christian culture born out of the 60s. The history is linguistic one. On how these people understood the documents in their own language. Translators don't pull their definitions out of the air, they pull from the literature which was of the same time as the documents they are translating. Keeping with the culture which was then. We adopt that ancient culture as how we are to behave, not to inject our own modern culture bias into their writings, therefore losing all meaning.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

I started on 3rd shift in 2011. For a week I slept ok. Then it hit. I did probably average 5 hours sleep per day. I retired in January so Im back to regular 1st shift type hours. It has been very hard so far. I thought I would quickly adjust but its slow transitioning so far.

Amen, but you and I aren't getting younger. Therefore sleep (as good rest) deep sleep is important.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

The Greek means flowing down so much as it becomes ornamental. The Vulgate understands the Greek in its purest form, to allow to raise to maturity. Just like the Italian and the Spanish. So, these Latin cultures had hundreds of years of women NOT cutting their hair because of their understanding of their scriptures. American Modernists on the other hand were taught in English, with a Christian culture born out of the 60s. The history is linguistic one. On how these people understood the documents in their own language. Translators don't pull their definitions out of the air, they pull from the literature which was of the same time as the documents they are translating. Keeping with the culture which was then. We adopt that ancient culture as how we are to behave, not to inject our own modern culture bias into their writings, therefore losing all meaning.

Are you saying that a woman can't nurture, or raise her hair to maturity, allowing it to flow down so much as it becomes ornamental, if she trims dead ends, or cuts it to keep it from bothering her? Doesn't a farmer prune and trim the vine as part of nurturing, that it might grow to maturity and produce the most beautiful fruit?