Whoa! Polygamist solution is frightening...

[The Mrs]

I'm glad we're seeing more and more documentation and facts unfold, as well as, witnesses who used to be a part of this sect. They interviewed one young man who was one of those ousted as a teen. He's speaking out. As are others who used to be a part of this.

They have several girls who want to leave the sect, and they have several girls who are pregnant, or have proof of underage births. When all of this information is gathered I think we're going to see that they really have no justification.

It's not 'religious freedoms' that are under question here. You can't call this religious persecution. It's far from it. Laws are laws. If you break them, no matter who you are or why you're breaking them, you should be punished.

In the interviews with the mothers, for all their tears and wailing, 'we want our children back', and 'we were LIED to', I find it ironic that they are being caught in their own lies.

When asked point blank, 'are there underage children being married in your sect', they state, 'not that they have seen'. Heelllooooo???

[The Mrs]

Originally Posted by SOUNWORTHY

I love it when anyone uses the words, there may have been, especially when it is used by the liberal media. I'm as much for punishment for the guilty as anyone but who is guilty, the men or the women or maybe the children. What if the state got wind that your pastor was telling his congregation they needed to home school their children or if your pastor was accused by a angry teenager of molesting her or him and the police and CPA showed up on Sunday and removed all the under aged children from the parents. Check Goggle for the number of Apostolic churches that have been sued by bitter people.

If you have never been on the receiving end of having a foul mouthed accusing lawyer looking for blood, your blood, when you are innocent, you have no idea how these people feel.

Some of you have already tried these people, found them guilty and are ready to pull the switch on them. As far as the pictures of the women, I've seen some UPC women who look just as unhappy and old before their time as well as women who are not UPC. The news photographers can make a picture appear as they wish it to appear.

Where is the love for these people, should Jesus be here to stoop and write in the sand again? What was it He said, something about sin and stones. Apparently we have a lot of perfect people on here who are perfect and have never sinned because they have their hands full of stones.

Rico, I can't get over it because one of our churches may be next...

If there were facts being presented that denied allegations of abuse and breaking the law, I'm sure we'd be defending them.

As it is, there are MEN setting up their nice little kingdoms. Did you happen to see the video of one of the homes? I was shocked to see the living room. Did anyone else notice this? All the chairs were in rows and semi-circle facing one LARGE recliner at the front. Who's the big daddy now???

How could they possibly deny there was only one husband and many wives in that house.

[The Mrs]

I'm a bit surprised to see that some are stating that they could go after the UPC next.

I don't know of ANY UPC/Apostolic organizations who are breaking any laws.

Why would this even be a concern?

[Ron]

Originally Posted by The Mrs

I'm a bit surprised to see that some are stating that they could go after the UPC next.

I don't know of ANY UPC/Apostolic organizations who are breaking any laws.

Why would this even be a concern?

Because Mrs, even on this board parents who believe that a girl should not wear pants, or not cut thier hair, or restrict some of thier activities is akin to being in the cult!

Whether we like it or not, we as a society are heading in that direction.

[dizzyde]

Originally Posted by The Mrs

If there were facts being presented that denied allegations of abuse and breaking the law, I'm sure we'd be defending them.

As it is, there are MEN setting up their nice little kingdoms. Did you happen to see the video of one of the homes? I was shocked to see the living room. Did anyone else notice this? All the chairs were in rows and semi-circle facing one LARGE recliner at the front. Who's the big daddy now???

How could they possibly deny there was only one husband and many wives in that house.

Yeah, I am kind of at this point: with the people who are ignoring all of the facts in this situation. Apparently the "liberal media" has the power to make underage girls pregnant?

[dizzyde]

Originally Posted by Ron

Because Mrs, even on this board parents who believe that a girl should not wear pants, or not cut thier hair, or restrict some of thier activities is akin to being in the cult!

Whether we like it or not, we as a society are heading in that direction.

Brother, these people and many others, including ourselves have been considered "cults" for years. They didn't come after these people for being a cult, they came after them for blatant disregard for the law.

[The Mrs]

Originally Posted by Ron

Because Mrs, even on this board parents who believe that a girl should not wear pants, or not cut thier hair, or restrict some of thier activities is akin to being in the cult!

Whether we like it or not, we as a society are heading in that direction.

None of those things are against the law.

And with as many sects across this nation that express their religious beliefs in their dress, from Amish, to Mormon, to Mennonite, to Apostolic, I just can't see that ever being an issue.

[Ron]

Originally Posted by The Mrs

None of those things are against the law.

And with as many sects across this nation that express their religious beliefs in their dress, from Amish, to Mormon, to Mennonite, to Apostolic, I just can't see that ever being an issue.

Now don't get me wrong and don't misquote me, if there have been wrongs made then the people who did such things should be "Punished" but unless
all 400 + kids are found to be abused--they were wrong to take them all out.

I have seen it in Canada where an accusation can be made (even anonymously)
& the authorities will jump the gun & seize kids!!!!

Assuming people are guilty without proof is a very slippery slope to go down.

That is the big picture & that I think is what Christopher Hall & others are mentioning too.

[dizzyde]

Originally Posted by Ron

Now don't get me wrong and don't misquote me, if there have been wrongs made then the people who did such things should be "Punished" but unless
all 400 + kids are found to be abused--they were wrong to take them all out.

I have seen it in Canada where an accusation can be made (even anonymously)
& the authorities will jump the gun & seize kids!!!!

Assuming people are guilty without proof is a very slippery slope to go down.

That is the big picture & that I think is what Christopher Hall & others are mentioning too.

The fact remains that this is CPS policy across the board. It is not a religious issue. When accusations are made, this is what they do, regardless of what the circumstance.

I have seen it many, many times, I have worked in juvenile hall, the local homeless shelter, and the battered womens shelter. In the cases were it is unfounded, it is very upsetting, but I would rather a child go through a few days of inconvenience and trauma, than to have to go through a lifetime of abuse and trauma.

[Ron]

Originally Posted by dizzyde

The fact remains that this is CPS policy across the board. It is not a religious issue. When accusations are made, this is what they do, regardless of what the circumstance.

I have seen it many, many times, I have worked in juvenile hall, the local homeless shelter, and the battered womens shelter. In the cases were it is unfounded, it is very upsetting, but I would rather a child go through a few days of inconvenience and trauma, than to have to go through a lifetime of abuse and trauma.

And while I wouldn't want "ANY" child to be abused-"EVER" I would love to see there be a basis in proof for the authorities to step in.

I guess I am basing it on my experience in Canada where because of past cases it is shoot first-question later & more often then not it has caused problems & created a nightmare before the parents can be reunited!

I am sorry to offend anyone but I believe the burden of proof rests with the state & not with the burden of defense resting with families!